Messages

1

General / Re: A little puzzle for you with a huge reward. ;)

« on: October 07, 2019, 04:43:00 pm »

Johny

Also i don

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General / Re: So what improvements would benefit Underrail 2?

« on: August 13, 2019, 05:54:00 am »

We need more katanas in the game /s

To be more serious, I feel like the game might benefit from a couple key characters that have actual relationships with our main character. Like right now we meet a bunch of people but don't feel connect to any of them, since we complete their quest and never see them again., so it feels very lonely, not sure if that's intentional.

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General / Re: (Spoiler) Puzzle help. (Again)

« on: July 25, 2019, 12:41:56 am »

I solved it. To all those who are struggling read this.

Firstly, there are two sets of info you need. One is one the Admin level on a computer and contains a text of Musical notes, the only one you need to note down is the code and it'll look something like (Bb C A B) in musical notation.

Next is the info on the terminal next to the vault in the Security Tech section. In this you'll find a set of Interval and Octave keys for each person who worked there. Find the one that matches Mickey (he was the person whose terminal you got the code from, not sure if it changes) and note down the 1st and 3rd interval keys (Major third, perfect 6th, whatever it is) and the 3rd number in the octave keys (they should all have the same 3rd number). The rest is fluff if you're only interested in getting into the vault.

To make the cipher for the numbers you'll need to read a little about music theory but if you don't want to, the interval keys match a number called a semitone. Let's say you have interval keys of major 7th (11 semitones) and minor 6th (8 semitones) add these together and then count through the 12 notes of an octave C to B until you've raised it by 19 in our case our cipher will start at the note G, which corresponds to the letter Y (because the 3rd block of octaves corresponds to Y, Z and numbers 0-9 which is what we want).

Following through the musical notes you'll find that Ab=Z, A=0, Bb-1 etc. This means our code from the example above will be 1302.

Hope this helps, write if you have any questions.

So what is the 3rd number in the octave keys used for? feel like i don't quite understand that part yet.

Edit:
you know, I'm just going to give up on this one, have no idea what's going on here.

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General / Re: Faster travel?

« on: July 02, 2019, 05:45:59 pm »

if you got tired of the slow character walking speed, download cheat engine and use the guide below

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/use-cheat-engine-to-speed-up-games.1164528/

you can have multiple speed up settings up from 2x to 5x, nowadays i play on 2x all the time as it saved up a lot of time i almost consider cheat engine to be a must have if you want to play through the game many times.

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General / Re: Expedition alpha testing

« on: June 01, 2019, 10:30:34 pm »

Same! long time lurker here and would love to test the game, have played the base game three times on normal so I can't wait!

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General / Re: Your opinion on uniques?

« on: February 14, 2019, 10:58:15 pm »

Dragunov is really good because you can get two shots off with a sniper rifle, of course it is inferior to crafted spearhead as it should be, since you can get it without investing points into crafting.

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General / Re: DC spawn rate radically increased?

« on: January 26, 2019, 04:28:15 am »

Pretty sure the stealth gaunts just spawn endlessly, after I was done with DC, that map area was littered with faceless corpses you almost can't walk anywhere without stepping on a corpse, it was pretty nuts.

I was using a weird melee build so that's fine with me, but if you are using ammos or bolts, the only way to counter that is just to not walk there, grab everything you need from the warehouse and don't go there afterwards.

The faceless patrol teams are not endless though, they can go from area to area but kill them once and they are done.

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 10, 2017, 05:15:07 am »

Effective use of incendiary and gas grenades isn't gated behind any particular skills or feats, so any build can use them to create a killing field for the Faceless near Core City.

If you use grenades on any build - it is grenade build, and not sonething different.

You cannot access the pillars below Core City without joining the Praetorians. The area JKK sends you to may unlock after the warehouse attack no matter which faction you join, but Jookhela's area never does.

Shit.

that's just a matter of syntax, but seeing how little you have to put into grenade, I have to disagree, it's even possible to use grenade with 0 throwing, so any build can use them.

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 04, 2017, 06:58:17 pm »

I won't even try to analyse throwing knives as my experience with them is laughably limited, but I would be inclined to agree that they are pretty crap (I've always thought of them mainly as a poison-delivery device for characters with Throwing, but I don't think that's the developer's intent). For chemical pistols, just doing something about the inability to benefit from stacked effects would make a huge difference to them. Some kind of AP cost mitigation would be good too, even just making them work with Gunslinger.

there's just too many perks out there about throwing knifes that I can't resist, do you think poison need a buff?

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 04, 2017, 06:53:44 pm »

all of them are good points that I cannot argue with, and as you said I highly value the cc and bypass nature and the damage type of chemical pistol, to the point where I do not consider the damage difference to put chemical pistol as vastly inferior or inferior in everyway compared to 0.44 and its positives and negatives, whether it's alright to buff chemical pistols or not I do not know, but I strongly think throwing knives should be buffed before the developer even touch chemical pistol (doing a throwing knives poison build right now) , all the points, either good or bad about chemical pistols are already made, so I rest my case unless someone has something new to add.

I won't even try to analyse throwing knives as my experience with them is laughably limited, but I would be inclined to agree that they are pretty crap (I've always thought of them mainly as a poison-delivery device for characters with Throwing, but I don't think that's the developer's intent). For chemical pistols, just doing something about the inability to benefit from stacked effects would make a huge difference to them. Some kind of AP cost mitigation would be good too, even just making them work with Gunslinger.

Actually throwing knives do alright (not good, not great, just passable) damage if you max DEX and throwing. The problem w/ them is that a throwing knives build lacks something like expose weakness, so is helpless against high Mech resist target. You can combine grenades + quick tinkering + traps to cover this weakness but it's not ideal.

yep, in my current build I have to rely on grenades a lot against high armor enemy.

the damage is passable and I can definitely complete normal with this, but I prefer all my other builds over this in term of power level.

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 04, 2017, 06:50:27 pm »

I made no such statements that chemical pistol is a overall better weapon than the pistol, only that the w2c is inferior to the by pass nature of the chemical pistol, which you did not address.

Let me adress that.

Mechanical damage with W2C ammo is the all-around most effective damage type in the entire game, no contest. This is because unlike all other damage types in the game, the DR against W2C bullets will never be higher than 35%. That's in theory, in practice it will never be higher than 33% since the highest mechanical DR in the game is 95% (Cuttlesnail). That's without counting damage modifiers from things like Conditioning, but those can apply to other damage types as well, including heat.

All other damage types are ineffective against enemies with high respective resistances or even an immunity. Acid will be harmless against mutants and deep worms, fire will be very ineffective against bladelings or industrial bots and somewhat ineffective against any NPC wearing an antithermic coat, even otherwise irresistible mental damage is useless against robots, etc.

On the other hand there is not a single enemy in the entire game W2C bullets would be ineffective against, except Godmen of course.

This is the main problem with energy/chemical pistols if you ask me, they get very little support from other sources such as mods, feats or ammo types. If you compare a .44 hammerer and an incendiary pistol without any mods, feats or ammo types, they will be pretty evenly matched. Energy/chemical pistols are solid at their core, they just need more bonus goodies other weapon types get.

Also, if any of the chemical pistols really needs to be buffed, it's the cryoliquid pistol. That thing is just irredeemable crap, I don't think I ever saw a build made around it.

yeah cryoliquid pistol is indeed the weakest out of all three chemical pistols, I'd still equip it if I have 3 slots though since it offers more utility which I'm very much for, increase the chance of freeze and it's a good cc weapon.

you make good point about w2c, but have you considered energy shield? to bypass energy completely is still preferable than w2c in my mind

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 03, 2017, 10:25:13 pm »

Denying the validity of using utilities to set up ambush situations is somewhat absurd, I think you're just withdrawing into a strict weapon vs weapon position to try to make your argument more tenable. Lots of builds use Ambush without access to an item that goes in a weapon slot and can set things on fire, that doesn't make use of Ambush an invalid consideration in the effectiveness of those builds. The question is, which weapon makes better use of Ambush, a chemical pistol or a firearm? You can illuminate multiple targets at once with a utility rather than wasting shots doing it one at a time with an incendiary pistol, and the .44 can deliver much more devastating criticals than any chemical pistol.

You should reread that statement. It says that with a chemical pistol you're trading 3-4 times the maximum damage for damage over time. It also says that even with damage over time accounted for, the weapon can't match the average damage that a .44 would have dealt immediately. I'll concede that I was specifically talking about acid blob pistols in that case and didn't specify. Since you're still insisting that acid blob pistols are worthwhile, here's a bit more number crunching, all components QL130:

Here's the acid blob pistol itself, since its on hit effects don't show up in combat stats:

In other words if you are willing to juggle enemies to avoid wasted damage from lack of proper effect stacking, and willing to let them die over a period of three rounds rather than immediately, you can squeeze almost as much as the average damage of a .44 out of an acid blob pistol with a standard shot.

So what do you actually get for using the thing? Well, you get acid entanglement, and you get acid damage. You seem to value the latter very highly; I don't, I've found the ability to switch between JHP and W2C rounds much more valuable than the ability to switch between damage types, because I would rather be able to mitigate (or punish a lack of) resistances to my primary weapons's damage type than have to switch to another weapon depending on the target's resistances. The choice ultimately comes down to single-target CC, or higher damage/stronger criticals/stronger special attacks. I can't possibly see a case for the acid blob pistol in those terms, as its on hit chance is always too low; even with a QL150 dispenser it's a coin flip, which is simply not good enough for a single target weapon that is so weak in every other area.

very useful effects like entangle and fear that make some fights trivial compared to 0.44, one fight that I can think of is the carnifex fight.

You don't say?

you are correct that I'm using a strict weapon vs weapon argument to strength my argument, and that might be a bad argument, I don't think how fire chemical pistol is not better than grenade though in both damage and proc chance, plus the burning ground thing, you are also shooting at one person at a time, so I don't see the benefit of setting multiple people on fire.

that's about it, the rest comes down to personal preference and the definition of the word "inferior" and "vastly inferior".

by the way, if you can get three shots off acid chemical pistol in a turn, the chance of landing the on hit effect is around 70%, so not really a coin flip, just a little info for anyone who wants to try out the duel chemical pistol build.

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 03, 2017, 10:04:55 pm »

As a show of good faith here's the stats on a QL130 incendiary pistol, also; they do compare much more favourably to other weapons than the acid blob pistol.



48.5 average damage per shot, but the on hit effect is much better than the acid blob pistol. It's 247 average damage per shot over three turns when it inflicts burning, and that occurs with basically double the frequency of acid entanglement. Total average is about 217 damage per shot. Between its much higher damage over time and its fear effect, that would almost turn this weapon into the electroshock pistol of the chemical pistol world, except for a couple of things - firstly, fire damage isn't particularly good, with every robotic enemy highly resistant to it and half of them immune to burning, every other human opponent equipped with antithermic armour and likewise immune to burning, etc. Secondly, as mentioned, the game has no handling for the stacking of the burn effect (even acid entanglement handles it by refreshing the effect with the new damage value applied; burning just ignores subsequent applications entirely), which is a huge problem and in my opinion needs fixing - the fear and damage effects of the burning status should be separated into one visible and one invisible effect, and further applications of burning should either increase the damage inflicted in subsequent rounds, extend the number of rounds the target burns, or some combination of the two. As it is, there is no way to focus fire on a single target with chemical pistols, you just lose a tonne of damage by doing so.


I should probably say, I am not 'rooting' for firearms to be more awesome than anything else. I don't want them to be, I want everything to be well-balanced. But I don't see how you could look at the way things are now and see them as balanced. (Although in saying that, Styg will probably nerf regular pistols again now )

wow, thanks for the math

yeah, that's why I tend pair fire and acid together as they work really well.

all of them are good points that I cannot argue with, and as you said I highly value the cc and bypass nature and the damage type of chemical pistol, to the point where I do not consider the damage difference to put chemical pistol as vastly inferior or inferior in everyway compared to 0.44 and its positives and negatives, whether it's alright to buff chemical pistols or not I do not know, but I strongly think throwing knives should be buffed before the developer even touch chemical pistol (doing a throwing knives poison build right now) , all the points, either good or bad about chemical pistols are already made, so I rest my case unless someone has something new to add.

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 03, 2017, 09:46:20 pm »

since we are talking about the weapon itself instead of build, anything outside of that particular weapon is irrelevant, as I can also counter the low damage of chemical pistol by saying the damage can be easily made up by an off hand SMG.

Talking about weapon while not talking about how it plays in the actual game is pointless. And if you are using SMG, you are better off using it as main weapon instead of chemical pistol. Greandes are supplementary weapons, they have their own slots and all you need to use them is good DEX and couple points in throwing. I'm not saying that regular pistol is better then chem because you can use grenades. I'm saying that grenades are far superior to incendiary pistol when it comes to activating Ambush, so having this pistol on your hand is not really an advantage.

you are correct that the initial damage of the 0.44 pistol is about 3 times that of a chemical pistols, but the original statement that I replied to said the maximum damage, so my point still stands that the original statement is incorrect counting the on hit effect of chemical pistol.

Don't really see what your point is here. I was just providing numbers to compare those two and hammerer is just superior in EVERY way. Also, that means that your original statement is wrong, because maximum damage is more than 2-3 times higher. It's 4 times higher.

but I feel the difference in direct damage is not flexible when compared to chemical pistol, as the damage of the on hit effect bypass BOTH shield and most armor, the majority damage coming from on hit effect, with very useful effects like entangle and fear that make some fights trivial compared to 0.44, one fight that I can think of is the carnifex fight.

While chemical pistol build has it's enemies entangled and on fire, regular pistol build has it's enemies dead. I don't think i need to explain why later is better.

pistol indeed have special ammos for different situation, but the bypass nature from the chemical pistol is still preferred over, say, W2C, chemical pistol also has corrosive acid that's very useful for the endgame boss and possibly the next expansion.

W2C reduce mechanical resist by 65%. In vast majority of cases it makes this resistance negligible. 10-20% resistance is not enough to put chemical pistols ahead. Maybe you should compare actual numbers instead of intuitively gauging it? Like i did.

Regular pistol build has access to it's ammo for 95% of the game. Corrosive acid is something you get at the endgame only. Also, unlike regular pistol with W2C, chemical pistols loose most of their precious dot when fighting final boss. So i don't think they have any advantage in this fight, since even without any resistance we have an enemy with 2k health and damage form chem pistols is not even close to regular or energy ones.

grenades are far superior than the fire chemical pistol? I think you need the elaborate more on that, as both the proc chance and damage is lower, and I'm also not sure if it trigger ambush as maybe the fire on the ground counts as a light source and thus nullify the effect, could someone clarify?

4 times the overall damage? could you show me your calculation? I suspect you are confusing initial damage vs overall damage.

once you got an enemy entangled and set on fire, they might as well be dead, so I think you and I both agree that we want our enemy dead.

I made no such statements that chemical pistol is a overall better weapon than the pistol, only that the w2c is inferior to the by pass nature of the chemical pistol, which you did not address.

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General / Re: Chemical/energy pistols

« on: October 02, 2017, 07:55:29 pm »

I ignored your point about Ambush because as MirddinEmris noted, anyone can make use of Ambush with incendiary grenades if they wish to. It's not an advantage that chemical pistols have over anything else.

I'll add one more thing to the figures mentioned above, specifically about why the damage over time from a incendiary pistol is inferior to the direct damage of a .44: the former doesn't stack. The damage doesn't get added onto, the effect doesn't last longer or even get reset - the ticks of the initial effect just keep running down with no subsequent shot affecting them in any way at all. That's particularly relevant since you brought up Ambush, because unless you illuminate your targets in some other way before you begin shooting, the situation will typically be that you shoot a target, set it on fire, and then it will take paltry damage over the next two turns from your initial non-critical shot whilst the criticals you inflict on it now that it's burning aren't able to take advantage of the damage over time bonus on the weapon. I almost consider this to be a bug. Though I do understand why it works this way, it's because the fear and damage over time effects of the burning status are rolled into the one thing, and if you could reapply a burning status it could keep an enemy indefinitely feared.

your point about incendiary grenades is addressed.

you are correct that the on hit effect of the fire don't stack, that's why it's necessary for me to equip another acid pistol with a higher base damage and on hit effect, but as you said fear is a very op status, and typically when you are facing a mob you really just want to shoot them once.