Underrail Forum
Underrail => Development Log => Topic started by: Styg on April 24, 2017, 02:24:22 pm
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Hi guys. We're all but done with the biggest feature of the expansion and that's the player's ability to ride jet skis.
(http://underrail.com/images/DevLog/Expedition/JetskiTrail.gif)
Since the expansion takes place on Black Sea, naturally you will need a way to travel between all the small islands, bays and between far shores. You will be able to do this on a dozen of different jet skis, ranging from super light racing jet skis to mini-destroyers, which you can further customize under the hood by installing better engines, batteries and suspension systems. The models themselves differ way by the combat cover, durability, stability, speed, damage resistances, as well number of and maximum size of a parts you can install into them; some vehicles can have multiple engines and/or batteries. Also, some jet skis will have special attacks or abilities.
(http://underrail.com/images/DevLog/Expedition/VehicleWindow.PNG)
Once you get to the Black Sea it won't take long for you to get a hold of the most basic "junk jet", but to get the quality stuff, both in terms of the jet ski model and the parts, you'll have to spend a fair amount of charons at a specialized shop in Core City. You'll also have to decide what are the most important characteristics of jet ski for you, as no one model will be best at everything.
(http://underrail.com/images/DevLog/Expedition/JetSkis.PNG)
While riding a jet ski you'll be able to use most of your weapons, abilites and utilities. The most notable exceptions are sledgehammers and sniper rifles, which are not available while driving. Also, short range melee weapons (fist weapons and knives) and unarmed attacks, though still performable, will suffer significant penalties. When an attack is aimed at you, it has a chance of hitting the jet ski instead (or in case of AoE attacks, a percentage of the damage hits the vehicle), depending on the cover it provides, in which case the damage is tested against its resistences and the amount that penetrates those is deducted from the vehicle's durability. If the durability reaches zero, the vehicle is destroyed and you die (you never learned to swim).
That's it for now, guys. Let us know how all this sounds and I hope you're looking forward to some naval battles with pirates and worse things.
(http://underrail.com/images/DevLog/Expedition/PiratesOnJetskis.PNG)
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Awesome doesn't even begin to describe how this sounds. You have really outdone yourselves this time. I have so many questions but I will try to keep them to a minimum.
1. Will we be able to use crafting to create better parts or upgrade the jet skis in any other way?
2. Will they be limited only to the expansion, or will we be able to ride them around base game areas as well? I doubt it since there are not that many places in the game where that could be done, but I could imagine riding them around the cave waters.
3. Was making only sledgehammers and sniper rifles unusable (rather than all two-handed weapons, so assault rifles, crossbows, two-handed shotguns, etc.) a balance issue?
Don't get me wrong I'm probably the last person to complain about having to improvise and adapt. It just seems to me like excluding other two-handed weapons would give a whole new reason to consider using smaller weapons such as pistols, SMGs, etc. and make them much more attractive. Particularly firearm pistols, making them even more worthwhile as a "sidearm" type of weapon. I could understand leaving crossbows usable though since they have no alternatives.
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Can barely wait to try those out. Gotta love that Waterworld pirates flair (minus the bright blue sky).
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5464/9621595498_82c82dbfae_b.jpg)
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Awesome doesn't even begin to describe how this sounds. You have really outdone yourselves this time. I have so many questions but I will try to keep them to a minimum.
1. Will we be able to use crafting to create better parts or upgrade the jet skis in any other way?
2. Will they be limited only to the expansion, or will we be able to ride them around base game areas as well? I doubt it since there are not that many places in the game where that could be done, but I could imagine riding them around the cave waters.
3. Was making only sledgehammers and sniper rifles unusable (rather than all two-handed weapons, so assault rifles, crossbows, two-handed shotguns, etc.) a balance issue?
Don't get me wrong I'm probably the last person to complain about having to improvise and adapt. It just seems to me like excluding other two-handed weapons would give a whole new reason to consider using smaller weapons such as pistols, SMGs, etc. and make them much more attractive. Particularly firearm pistols, making them even more worthwhile as a "sidearm" type of weapon. I could understand leaving crossbows usable though since they have no alternatives.
1. For the moment, crafting has no impact on vehicles. All components will be purchased or found. But we might add crafting recipes here in the future.
2. There's a big body of water connecting Core City, SGS, Junkyard and Camp Hathor. You'll be able to travel these waters.
3. For the snipers it kinda made sense. Similarly for the sledgehammers, but there was also an issue of animation, especially in the sitting position.
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Words can't express how much I love this shite. To reiterate what I said on FB, this game is more 90s than any CRPG back in the day ever was 8) .
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*snip
3. For the snipers it kinda made sense. Similarly for the sledgehammers, but there was also an issue of animation, especially in the sitting position.
Question: does this mean sniper-only and hammer-only characters are non-viable for the expansion?
Looks like psi users are still top dog, while brawler and psi monk got shafted hard. :'(
Still looking forward to everything and planning on day 1 purchase.
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3. Was making only sledgehammers and sniper rifles unusable (rather than all two-handed weapons, so assault rifles, crossbows, two-handed shotguns, etc.) a balance issue?
3. For the snipers it kinda made sense. Similarly for the sledgehammers, but there was also an issue of animation, especially in the sitting position.
If it makes sense for sniper rifles and sledgehammers, it should apply to assault rifles too, no?
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Question: does this mean sniper-only and hammer-only characters are non-viable for the expansion?
I don't think it's going to be bad to the point of not being viable whatsoever. I'm assuming in some situations snipers will be able to reach enemies on jet skis while standing on the ground thanks to their long range.
As for sledges, If you look closely at the gif and the vehicle window, you can clearly see it's equipped with not one but three rocket launchers.
That said it does sound like sledges will struggle a little bit more. We will see. Kinda wish it at least applied to assault rifles as well for the sake of consistency, but oh well.
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2. There's a big body of water connecting Core City, SGS, Junkyard and Camp Hathor. You'll be able to travel these waters.
I guess that means it's time to bust out epeli's old alpha maps that had the waterways in them! :P
In all seriousness, I am SUPER excited about this addition to the game, and I cannot wait to see how this mixes things up. Your statement has got me very curious about something, though: does this mean you'll now be able to access places like the Silent & Forsaken Isles without having to convince a boat captain to take you?
Also, will the jet skis only be found in the areas added with the expansion, or will they be accessible in places like the Junkyard Docks, Core City Docks, Camp Hathor, etc? If so, I assume that they won't be available until after the railways get cleared, to prevent sequence-breaking.
Lastly, are we gonna get the chance to have a high-speeds boat race around the waters of the Black Sea? :P Something like the Gauntlet on jet skis, where entering combat mode is disabled or something to make the race as genuine as possible? Normally I hate racing mini-games, but for some reason I get the feeling it would be awesome in Underrail. IDK, maybe I'm crazy. :P
Sorry for all the questions; I'm just so excited!! ;D
No matter how the system ends up working, I greatly look forward to conquering the seas as the Dread Pirate Altos! >:D
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Wish there were a bit more info about jet ski weapons, but that triple rocket-launcher already got me. Shame there is no hammerin' time while riding.
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Can we meet those huge creatures whose bones we can see on gif? Or learn what they are/were?
Can we fish from jet skis?
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Can we meet those huge creatures whose bones we can see on gif? Or learn what they are/were?
Can we fish from jet skis?
Regarding the first two questions, you'll just have to play to find out.
You cannot fish from jet skis.
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Haha, this I didn't expect. Looks really neat.
...Although now I want a customizable dreadnought. :D
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*snip
3. For the snipers it kinda made sense. Similarly for the sledgehammers, but there was also an issue of animation, especially in the sitting position.
Question: does this mean sniper-only and hammer-only characters are non-viable for the expansion?
Looks like psi users are still top dog, while brawler and psi monk got shafted hard. :'(
Still looking forward to everything and planning on day 1 purchase.
Lol looks like I pissed off Styg for some reason as this is the second time my questions were ignored. Oh well I still love this game. *shrug*
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Very unexpected. That jet ski animation looks VE-E-ERY choppy. Are you planning to work on improving it? Gives me a headache just by looking at it.
Come to think of it the game seems to be limited to 60FPS, can the limit be removed? maybe that would help with choppiness a bit.
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*snip
3. For the snipers it kinda made sense. Similarly for the sledgehammers, but there was also an issue of animation, especially in the sitting position.
Question: does this mean sniper-only and hammer-only characters are non-viable for the expansion?
Looks like psi users are still top dog, while brawler and psi monk got shafted hard. :'(
Still looking forward to everything and planning on day 1 purchase.
Lol looks like I pissed off Styg for some reason as this is the second time my questions were ignored. Oh well I still love this game. *shrug*
It's rather hard to be sniper only or sledgehammer only because you can also use all other melee and guns. Sure, you won't be as good as with weapon you specialize in but you should be good enough.
I had a 'pistol only' character and tried to use SMGs in DC. Not those awesome crafted ones, mind you, just the best unique i found. I didn't use "No, fuck *you*" ammo A.K.A. w2c, but the regular bullets and i was stomping DC creatures just fine.
So i wouldnt worry at least for snipers. As for sledge users - expansion will add two STR oriented weapons so they might be fine as well. I'd rather worry about DEX oriented melee.
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*snip
3. For the snipers it kinda made sense. Similarly for the sledgehammers, but there was also an issue of animation, especially in the sitting position.
Question: does this mean sniper-only and hammer-only characters are non-viable for the expansion?
Looks like psi users are still top dog, while brawler and psi monk got shafted hard. :'(
Still looking forward to everything and planning on day 1 purchase.
Lol looks like I pissed off Styg for some reason as this is the second time my questions were ignored. Oh well I still love this game. *shrug*
No, it doesn't mean that. Bulk of the combat will still be occurring on the dry land.
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Very unexpected. That jet ski animation looks VE-E-ERY choppy. Are you planning to work on improving it? Gives me a headache just by looking at it.
Come to think of it the game seems to be limited to 60FPS, can the limit be removed? maybe that would help with choppiness a bit.
Could be just the GIF, but in either case, no we do not plan on improving it further, there's only so much we can do in this engine.
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Hey Styg, can you give us some update how the development goes in general, I mean what still needs to be done in terms of new areas, mechanics, etc. Do you still have some surprises in the store?
You also mentioned couple of years ago in one of the development blogs that you would like to come up with a solution how to address a problem that there is no running option in the game - any update here?
Additionally, do you consider making an early access for the expansion?
Many thanks for your time
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Hey Styg, can you give us some update how the development goes in general, I mean what still needs to be done in terms of new areas, mechanics, etc. Do you still have some surprises in the store?
You also mentioned couple of years ago in one of the development blogs that you would like to come up with a solution how to address a problem that there is no running option in the game - any update here?
Additionally, do you consider making an early access for the expansion?
Many thanks for your time
- Regarding new mechanics we're mostly done. There's going to be one more interesting mechanical feature revealed in a future dev log. When it comes to areas, I wouldn't want to spoil anything, but there's one more big theme that will be revealed and one smaller that will not be revealed (since it relates to the DLC's endgame). There's also a couple of minor stuff that might or might not be shown in the logs, but probably won't be discussed directly as I prefer to leave it to players to discover these sort of things.
- Citation needed.
- No, but we might take on some testers to play it prior to the official release.
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Thanks for update, regarding my question about running, quote from dev blog below:
There is no running option - The main problem here I think is that backtracking through the areas you already explored, as well as moving through the non-hostile areas, such as the SGS, is too slow. I'm not quite sure yet how I'll address it. Just adding a running option is not that easy as there's a lot of stuff to be consider there and it would also need new animation on all those character models, etc. I'll have to think on how to address this one.
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Oh I see, thx for explanation.
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Could be just the GIF, but in either case, no we do not plan on improving it further, there's only so much we can do in this engine.
I thought you made your custom engine. Fixing timestep making it frame independent will make the game future proof (*cough* 21:9 next *cough* ). Reading material: http://gafferongames.com/game-physics/fix-your-timestep/
You owe it to future generations! 8)
It can also be a first step towards tackling the speed hack issue. People shouldn't have to hack your game to enjoy it. Please don't ignore the issue.
Thanks
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Could be just the GIF, but in either case, no we do not plan on improving it further, there's only so much we can do in this engine.
I thought you made your custom engine. Fixing timestep making it frame independent will make the game future proof (*cough* 21:9 next *cough* ). Reading material: http://gafferongames.com/game-physics/fix-your-timestep/
You owe it to future generations! 8)
It can also be a first step towards tackling the speed hack issue. People shouldn't have to hack your game to enjoy it. Please don't ignore the issue.
Thanks
I did, but that doesn't mean it's without limitations. Timestep is already frame rate independent.
What speed hack issue?
And the damn future generations can make their own games if they don't appreciate our 60 fps standards!
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I did, but that doesn't mean it's without limitations. Timestep is already frame rate independent.
What speed hack issue?
Oh I thought 60fps lock was due to animations being tied to framerate. I thought I remember getting to Core city and seeing framerate take a dive and game get slow because of it. Am I remembering that wrong?
Speed hack issue is where players resort to using Cheat Engine to make the character move around the map faster by speeding up the game. This is partly due to "run" mode being missing I guess.
Can that functionality be built into a game? I don't want to have cheatengine on my computer at all, i heard it gets people VAC banned on steam in some situations. But I can't play without it anymore.
And the damn future generations can make their own games if they don't appreciate our 60 fps standards!
lol...
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I did, but that doesn't mean it's without limitations. Timestep is already frame rate independent.
What speed hack issue?
Oh I thought 60fps lock was due to animations being tied to framerate. I thought I remember getting to Core city and seeing framerate take a dive and game get slow because of it. Am I remembering that wrong?
Speed hack issue is where players resort to using Cheat Engine to make the character move around the map faster by speeding up the game. This is partly due to "run" mode being missing I guess.
Can that functionality be built into a game? I don't want to have cheatengine on my computer at all, i heard it gets people VAC banned on steam in some situations. But I can't play without it anymore.
And the damn future generations can make their own games if they don't appreciate our 60 fps standards!
lol...
I'm not going to build in the speed hack into the game, but you can turn off Steam while you're playing if you're worried you'll get banned since it doesn't require it.
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This is great
Are we going to have any penalties for using throwable items while using the jet ski ?
Can we damage the enemy arms/hands, to drop him or her in the water ?
Can't wait for this expansion
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This is great
Are we going to have any penalties for using throwable items while using the jet ski ?
Can we damage the enemy arms/hands, to drop him or her in the water ?
Can't wait for this expansion
Throwing precision will suffer the same penalty as regular ranged weapons.
No, there's no swimming mechanics in the game so that would be kinda cheesy way to kill an opponent.
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I'm not going to build in the speed hack into the game, but you can turn off Steam while you're playing if you're worried you'll get banned since it doesn't require it.
I can but this sucks.
Pillars of eternity does it. Press "D" for 2x speed. I was hopping to see improvements in Expansions in this area. What is so wrong with speed acceleration within the game? Many of games had it no need to re-invent the wheel.
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This is great
Are we going to have any penalties for using throwable items while using the jet ski ?
Can we damage the enemy arms/hands, to drop him or her in the water ?
Can't wait for this expansion
Throwing precision will suffer the same penalty as regular ranged weapons.
No, there's no swimming mechanics in the game so that would be kinda cheesy way to kill an opponent.
Thank you Styg
Last question: will there be an easy way of checking the amount of remaining fuel, while you're using a jet ski ?
The last thing I want is accidentally saving game above a body of water, in the jet ski, and running out of fuel before reaching one of the islands
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I'm not going to build in the speed hack into the game, but you can turn off Steam while you're playing if you're worried you'll get banned since it doesn't require it.
I can but this sucks.
Pillars of eternity does it. Press "D" for 2x speed. I was hopping to see improvements in Expansions in this area. What is so wrong with speed acceleration within the game? Many of games had it no need to re-invent the wheel.
Changing game speed is not cool, as it also changes game balance in ways that is bad for gameplay and immersion.
Some examples:
-The Mercantile skill is greatly devalued if you can just fast forward until merchants restock/rebuy.
-Same with Salesman and any other feats that deal with the shop mechanic.
-Pack Rathound feat loses its value if you can super-sprint from A to B with your stuff.
-Same with the Strength statistic and strength boosting gear.
-Same with Agility and equipment that help with speed.
-As added consequense, slow builds becomes much better as speed is not an issue.
-Flowers, mushrooms, animals and other things that reappear after a while is suddenly unlimited as you zoom through time. Unlimited drugs for you.
-As you move faster, the world gets smaller. One of the cool things about Underrail is the sense of a large world.
-As you zoom from shop to shop selling your stuff and zooming through time, you get so much money that you buy everything, totally fucking game balance.
-And much more...
So to sum up, speed hack is pure cheating and probably fun if you are into that stuff, but completely alter the game in ways that make some builds more powerful than intended, and make certain game elements lose its value.
It has absolutely no place in the base game.
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Jet Skis are truly a unique addition to isometric game. Not even Fallout 1-2 had Jet Skis. :) Awaiting completion.
Congratulations for these innovations!! 8)
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Thank you Styg
Last question: will there be an easy way of checking the amount of remaining fuel, while you're using a jet ski ?
The last thing I want is accidentally saving game above a body of water, in the jet ski, and running out of fuel before reaching one of the islands
yes
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Thank you Styg
Last question: will there be an easy way of checking the amount of remaining fuel, while you're using a jet ski ?
The last thing I want is accidentally saving game above a body of water, in the jet ski, and running out of fuel before reaching one of the islands
yes
There's a bar tha shows it. And if you run out of energy, your jet ski will still be able to move, just very slowly (think: some auxiliary low power ultra-long life battery that they all have installed), so you won't ever get stuck for that reason.
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So to sum up, speed hack is pure cheating and probably fun if you are into that stuff, but completely alter the game in ways that make some builds more powerful than intended, and make certain game elements lose its value.
It has absolutely no place in the base game.
Indeed. I don't have anything against people doing this (and they already can and do, very easily), but I have no interest in accomodating these sort of crude game pacing manipulations.
That is not to say that the player's desire to move more quickly around the world is necessarily bad and unwarranted and that I consider the current pacing perfect. It's just that this sort of solution cannot be well integrated in the game at this point and, hance, as said, has no place in the game itself.
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If I wanna run through the game, I simply switch to combat mode. It's a crutch, but it works.
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It's just that this sort of solution cannot be well integrated in the game at this point and, hance, as said, has no place in the game itself.
That was just one, crude as you called it, solution to what some of us think is a problem with Underrail. I'm sure the community and you Styg can come up with a more elegant solution when (and if) you decide to do something about it. That's all.
Thanks!
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Thank you Styg
Last question: will there be an easy way of checking the amount of remaining fuel, while you're using a jet ski ?
The last thing I want is accidentally saving game above a body of water, in the jet ski, and running out of fuel before reaching one of the islands
yes
There's a bar tha shows it. And if you run out of energy, your jet ski will still be able to move, just very slowly (think: some auxiliary low power ultra-long life battery that they all have installed), so you won't ever get stuck for that reason.
Thanks guys
I'm glad it's not possible to get stuck, in that situation
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Are we still looking at a release date first half of 2017?
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Are we still looking at a release date first half of 2017?
Styg recently did an interview where he talks about the scope of the expansion here: http://pl.ign.com/underrail/10306/interview/jak-bedzie-wygladac-przyszlosc-dla-underrail--wywiad-z-dejan
Using google translate, we get a (very poor) translation: "When I was ready, I remembered about the first half of this year, but I do not think that people are still taking me seriously on this matter. We took on more work than we had originally planned, but we are going to do it well. How long will it take us?"
I think that means "we'll release it when it's done."
Classic Styg.
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Are we still looking at a release date first half of 2017?
Styg recently did an interview where he talks about the scope of the expansion here: http://pl.ign.com/underrail/10306/interview/jak-bedzie-wygladac-przyszlosc-dla-underrail--wywiad-z-dejan
Using google translate, we get a (very poor) translation: "When I was ready, I remembered about the first half of this year, but I do not think that people are still taking me seriously on this matter. We took on more work than we had originally planned, but we are going to do it well. How long will it take us?"
I think that means "we'll release it when it's done."
Classic Styg.
"When It's done. I mentioned first half of this year, but I do not think that people are still taking me seriously on this matter. We took on more work than we had originally planned, but we are going to do it well. It doesn't matter how long it will take us."
Tchort guide You.
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I may be late to the party, but MAN. I did NOT expect that. Nicely done, way to go. Looking forward to it.
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Will the expansion be save compatible ?
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Will the expansion be save compatible ?
Yes, you will be able to load your non-expansion save once you've installed the expansion.
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wow, haven't been here for a few months, mind's blown! Amazing stuff
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There's a bar tha shows it. And if you run out of energy, your jet ski will still be able to move, just very slowly (think: some auxiliary low power ultra-long life battery that they all have installed), so you won't ever get stuck for that reason.
I wonder if there's some implement that could be used to propel a floating watercraft. Some form of, I dunno, wooden stick that can kinda pull you along by pushing at the water. You'd have to ask a sailor, I don't speak boat.
(Seriously though I would laugh my butt off if there was a message or tooltip when you're out of fuel that read something to the tune of "Well shit, all out of gas. Better start paddling...")
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We can find at least two oddities in game, which are [ur=lhttp://underrail.com/wiki/index.php?title=Periscope_Part]Periscope Part[/url] - I'm sure that it mostly a joke and didn't meant anythong like that, but can we see or find something like submarine?
It seems to be very logical for expansion.
I was always thrilled to see in games content about see, water, and underwater exploration - I remember level with submarine in Thief 2 like it was yesterday, or Ocean Lab in Deus Ex - it is my favorite in that game. Also moments when you can find something at the bottom of a lake or river in Morrowind or Scyrim is only why I played those. Maybe it is many pirate stories I read in childhood, the atmosphere of mystery which are an integral part of the adventure at sea, somewhere on a lost island.
Anyway, do we have a chance we will get something like this? Maybe it would be just hint in the end, that would lead as to another adventure in next expansion. :)
Something like that mystery ship in Arcanum, that looked like fish if I remeber it right.
Just something - rusted half-visible hulk of the submarine.
Say maybe!
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I was soo hyped with Jet Skis i didn't notice those new crossbow bolts!
Pink poison. I bet it works like a charm (https://divinity.gamepedia.com/Charming_Arrow).
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I would be willing to put money down that you are right about the charm bolts.
I am anxiously awaiting information about the feats associated with the new weapon types
We did get a teaser in the Specialization and Veteran Level Changes dev log.
Decapitate - has to be associated with machetes (a machete ability that does X amount of additional damage and decapitates the individual if % total of damage is done?)
Onslaught - also guessing machetes (perhaps a machete/knife ability that does extra damage after the xth consecutive hit similar to combo)
Riposte - guessing spear (extra attack if incoming damage is successfully blocked)
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Thats good to hear. I'm pretty sure most sniper and sledgehammer builds tend to focus on those weapons specifically (snipers might have a sidearm but that tends to be an emergency option) so allowing them use on the skis will probably a big relief. Are there any penalties or bonuses based on weapon types?
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While riding a jet ski you'll be able to use most of your weapons, abilites and utilities. The most notable exceptions are sledgehammers and sniper rifles, which are not available while driving.
Breaking news for all the disappointed hammerers and snipers: You will be able to use your favorite weapons in naval combat!
(https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/493711721513615366/592621044565540866/SledgeandSniper.png)
I CAN SWING MY HAMMER WHILE RIDING ON THE BACK OF A MECHANICAL JET SKI KILLING MACHINE ;O
Dreams do come true...
I can finally live out my fantacy's as Deacon from waterworld ;D
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Thats good to hear. I'm pretty sure most sniper and sledgehammer builds tend to focus on those weapons specifically (snipers might have a sidearm but that tends to be an emergency option) so allowing them use on the skis will probably a big relief. Are there any penalties or bonuses based on weapon types?
Well, it's rather complex. Stability influences precision of all weapons, but more so the ranged ones. Maneuverability affects precision of only melee weapons. Knives, fist weapons and unarmed attacks are further penalized. Jet ski speed grants bonus damage to melee weapons. There's also a couple of feats that can alleviate some of these penalties or grants certain bonuses. You'll find that out by yourself.