Messages

1

Suggestions / Re: Feedback and requests

« on: October 01, 2013, 07:54:40 pm »

Underrail isn't the same as Wasteland 2. It's stands on it's own. Returning to your suggestion - while kickstarter for W2 indeed gave expectations of remaking the old type of RPG with the Underrail it isn't the case. Styg already said that most of the mechanics are already implemented and what is left - the content - is something else entirely. I also don't know if you researched this before but Styg is only one guy. It's one man project. Wanting such big change and saying: 'Underrail could add this to the existing system without needing to change any of the old content' is a bit you know... thoughtless?

And while I do get what are you saying with the W2 and Shadowrun being remade with Kickstarter it still just means that there are some people who like this stuff. Older games. Better times for developer. And this whole 'the grass was greener' deal. But what does it mean? Did you play Shadowrun Returns? How rehashing the nostalgia worked? For me it was bland as soup without salt. I can't speak for Wastelands 2. Yet. But sometimes people should let old ideas and games rest in peace.

Of course there were tons of old school games that were bad.

Shadowrun returns was horrible.  You can't even put Shadowrun and Wasteland in the same sentence in my book.  Wasteland 1 was a true sandbox - go anywhere do what you want, even if it means walking into a high level area and getting wasted at level 1.  The new Shadowrun is completely linear and boring.  However, it has prescripted dialogue trees the same way that Underrail does so in that sense they are the same (and the NPC interaction is horribly boring for me in both).

Every single core element of Underrail was implemented, at least in part, by one or another c64 game back in the 80's.  I have no idea how you are going to talk about letting old ideas rest in peace.... if you like Underrail that means you like the old ideas.  You can not name one new innovation in Underrail, and that is perfectly fine.  It has 90% of the best elements from the old games.  But there is still another 10% of the (good) old ideas that could be added imo.  Hybrid dialogues is one of them. 

Do me a favor:  spend 10 minutes and download a c64 emulator, and track down the roms for a game called 'newcomer'.  It is, I think, one of the most complex/deep/interesting/difficult RPG's in the history of cRPG's (orders of magnitude more difficult than Underrail).  If you play this for a bit and still think the complexity of hybrid dialogue is a bad thing, I will be surprised.  Then again, many would only see the graphics and write it off.

2

Suggestions / Re: Feedback and requests

« on: October 01, 2013, 04:54:15 pm »

It offers quick answers for the ADD gamer generation while allowing for deep questioning and easter eggs for those who want to search and take notes.

Stopped reading there, if you can't disagree without going for that card, then I'd rather not listen to your future opinions. Justifying ones "superiority" by calling on others for being the "ADD generation" is not only clueless but also very disrespectful. This is one of the main reasons I drag myself from reading forums about cRPGs from < 2000, the elitism is too high.

It seems to me that if you find the core systems implemented by the classic 'adventure' game (i.e. typing in text to solve puzzles) 'tedious' and 'unfun' then yes I think it's possible you have some attention deficit issues.  Talking about the ADD generation is in fact a scientific truth (though ADHD is the proper term).  Here are some numbers for you:

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/adhd.htm

Don't take what people say on forums personally - I didn't mean to blanket bash.  Any kids playing this game are well ahead of the curve.

3

Suggestions / Re: Feedback and requests

« on: October 01, 2013, 04:23:28 pm »

When people will learn that 'being hard' or 'being tedious' isn't necessary definition of fun? Also is taking notes fun for you? Not getting immersed enough to know what should you do next? Keeping a piece of paper full of puzzles which may or may not be useful and hoping it gets you further into the game? That is not my definition of fun. You may be one of the people who play 'Legend of Grimrock' with 'no map option' and think writing it down is all fun and games, but it clearly isn't such joy for everyone else, eh? So forcing it down their throat in the name 'RPGs should be hard, like old times' isn't gonna work.

Lastly... I do kinda agree with dumbing down and making games more approachable, but seriously I have enough selfconfidence to just ignore the games made for 'casual crowd' (with big wink!). And BTW since when RPGs became something we must toil in sweat and blood to aquire? They used to be, you know... fun? So please don't don't feel resentful - I do get it's your personal opinion, but so is mine. And I do feel that asking some things you wanted to, at this stage of developement is just nostalgia glasses which get forced on the game...

So yeah.

As a kid, I never saw taking investigation notes as tedious.  The thought would never have occurred to me then or now.  But that's a generational thing perhaps.

Let me clarify my suggestion a bit though...

I actually like what Fargo is doing with Wasteland 2, and think it would be the right solution for Underrail.   If you look at the demo video, he has a dialogue box with pre-fab answers (similar to what underrail has now) but in addition there is also a text box underneath.  So you only need to select the boxed answers to play the game, and it remembers some things for you so you don't have to write everything down.  BUT, if you want to go into deeper questioning with the text box, you can do that.  It offers quick answers for the ADD gamer generation while allowing for deep questioning and easter eggs for those who want to search and take notes.  Underrail could add this to the existing system without needing to change any of the old content.  I can't see how this suggestion would change your expereince:  You could play the game exactly as you do now.

Obviously the success of kickstarters like Wasteland 2 should give you an idea that there is some money to be made in having 'nostalgia glasses'.

4

Suggestions / Re: Feedback and requests

« on: October 01, 2013, 12:04:42 am »

As far as I know energy shields are one of the things that are still waiting for implementation. Also, while I do kinda agree on keyword search the game is already focused on the different kind of dialogue. I would guess that demanding such radical change now won't work. And, ending my two cents, I would say that using keywords to talk with NPCs isn't really that interesting as you're painting it. Especially if player forgot something (like you know, saving the game and leaving it for some time) and then remembers it and returns to playing.

It's hard enough to do that thing with normal RPGs... I wouldn't even dare to try with keyword ones.

Sounds like you have never played a cRPG with keyword dialogues.  It is pretty scary to me that RPG's are made so easy and have been dumbed down so much over the years.  This may be a shock to you but gamers actually used to take notes on what NPC's said so that they did NOT forget, and this complexity was actually part of the fun of the design.  If you think that is 'hard' to do, well it is something I did with RPG's when I was 8 years old.

5

Suggestions / Feedback and requests

« on: September 30, 2013, 09:22:45 pm »

First:

The game is super cool, and it's a great start to something.  It reminds me of my favorite c64 titles and that's a good thing.  The c64 game 'Mars Saga' is kind of like the grandfather of this game (whether the dev knows it or not).  However, these old c64 games had much much more content than this game.  For me, to call this a game you need at least as much content as a Wasteland, Mars Saga, Bards Tale, etc.  That's fine for an alpha, but take a look at the amount of content in these 25 year old RPG's and follow suit before you call this thing released.   Four floppy disks from the 80's should not have more content than a game release in 2013.

Dialogue:

One thing old school games did right was dialogue.  The best RPG's sometimes made players type in queries instead of always providing pre-fab answers to NPC questions.  I don't know when pre-fab dialogue came in vogue, but it was a huge step backward.  Load up your c64 emulator and play 'Newcomer' if you want to understand what I mean (another old school relative of this game).  When you force players to type in their queries, it forces them to pay attention to what all the NPC's say, and also allows for an unlimited amount of easter eggs to be put into NPC dialogue depending on what the players guess.  Keyword searches in interactive dialogue is not a programmatically difficult thing to implement, but will result in an infinitely more immersive RPG experience.

WASD for the love of God:

Please implement character mapping.  It drives me NUTS to have to pan my camera with arrow keys.  I end up sliding my keyboard to the left just to play the game.
I want to be able to set WASD camera panning, and ZXCVBN utility slots.  Then I could play the game without moving my keyboard around.  WASD camera panning should be default anyway, but at least allow a remap if not. 


Odds and ends:

Does anything spawn that is an optional component for an energy weapon?  I'm not sure if I'm getting bad dice rolls on the vendors or if nothing is implemented, however I SHOULD be able to mount a laser sight on an energy weapon.  The principle of a targeting laser is the same for bullets or plasma.  Now the icon of an energy gun makes it look like there is already a laser sight, however the precision buff is not as good as a laser sight on a mechanical gun.  Either allow me my laser sight, or increase the precision buff on laser weapons if they already have one.

Are shields in?  I made a cloaking device which was awesome (but it seemed very underpowered for the pricetag), but have not found any shield emitter parts.

Recycling needs a complete revamp.  Make it interesting and allow me a diceroll chance at getting some of the components of the item being recycled.  Like maybe I could recover a gun frame if I disassemble a gun that I find.  The chance of recovery could be modified by the appropriate skills (mechanics for disassembling guns for example).

Pickpocketing needs a slight balance and is a bit overpowered at times.  I can steal stacks of 50 bullets very early on.  I'd suggest a pickpocketing system that takes a percentage amount from large stacks rather than the entire stack (based on skill). 

Character creation needs some additions.  An in-game feat tree would be nice - some way to plan a character before you build it.  I want to know how stats impact things in more detail when I build my character.  I want to see how (for example) increasing my perception increases my detection points.  Or how increasing my con effects my fortitude and hit points.  I want to know what the heck fortitude DOES.  How is 10 fortitude different from 20.  I don't want to have to make my character BEFORE I see these things.

The buzzing noise from the in-game lights (I assume that is the source) is too much man.  After hearing that for a while I get a headache and have to take my headphones off.  Tone down the buzz please.

I'd like to be able to open locked items with alternate means from lockpicking and haxxoring.   Melee skill vs. locked box should work, and there should be small scale lock explosives in the demolitions crafting tree (use of these alternate unlocking skills should have a chance of destroying the items you are trying to get to as well).

I'll add more as I experiemnt with different builds...