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« on: December 31, 2015, 08:07:48 pm »
Hey guys, returning fan and first time poster here! I've seen a few topics on the subject, but most were questions or from the alpha stages, so I figured I'd start a proper discussion on it. If I've missed any major topics or news on this somehow, my apologies. Note that I use the classic system, since I prefer it, but from what I hear a lot of it also relates to the oddity system.
I wanted to bring this up because I've hit the maximum level pretty early in the game. I've done a handful of quests in the University and from what I can tell still have a third of the game in front of me. I've seen varying opinions on the level cap, but in mine, it almost instantly kills my enjoyment of the game.
Most of the time, the argument I see in favour of them is that it forces you to think about your build, since you have limited resources even in levelling. To some extend, I can understand that. However, there's a key flaw in this line of thinking; the only ones who know of this and can work with it like this are people replaying the game, who know the exacts of it. A new player is almost guaranteed to waste some points. Normally, this isn't too big of an issue; you might need to grind an extra level, but you'll be in good shape for the final areas. Now that isn't an option. Any time you struggle, all you can do is stare at the points you've wasted and wish you could relocate them.
Sure, you could restart, remake your build... But this is a bloody long game. If you're an explorer and a completionist, doubly so. My playtime is guaranteed to go into the triple digits if I finish the game. And even if you did, what then? Rush through the game, just doing main story quests and whatever netted you the biggest rewards? Because why would you bother doing anything more if you hit level cap just doing the bare basics?
And that, right there, is one of my major gripes. The limitations on looting and bartering mean that rewards from ventures into the unknown are already limited. Whether you'll find anything good, be it from drops or bartering, is in the hands of the RNG and will be better in the later levels anyway. The only permanent reward was the eternal march to a higher level. It meant that, no matter what you did, you'd come out stronger for it. It gave you reason to venture into places that didn't have good loot, like burrower dens, since the challenge alone makes you stronger. It's what I love about RPGs.
That ends when you hit the level cap. To make matters worse, there's not much new at higher levels in Underrail. More burrowers. More creepers. Coil spiders, those were new for a while, but not for long. And thus, exploring loses appeal. On a second playthrough, this is even worse. It's already less interesting since you've literally seen it before, but knowing that there's no point in the long run means it's a complete waste of time.
Now, I can understand wanting to limit player power. I don't agree with it, but that's because I'm the type of player who likes hitting New Game+ and facerolling all the enemies as I laugh my britches off. But while I prefer player choice, I can respect developer choice. As such, I can understand not just allowing unlimited levelling, much as I would love it. With that in mind, here are my suggestions:
1. After level 25, change the rules.
Don't raise the skill cap or raise it more slowly and give less skill points. Give no feats or simply less of them. Personally, I'd go for raising the cap by 1 per level, giving 20 points and a feat every 5 levels. It'll mean only minor increases in power, but a lateral expansion of abilities. This means that if you encounter an obstacle that your current skillset makes difficult or almost impossible to overcome (Bladelings come to mind) you can start investing in something that will help. It also might drive people to invest in crafting after paying it little attention, or learn to use more of what they can craft in the opposite case.
2. Rebuilding
At every level, give a certain amount of 'rebuild points', allowing you to reinvest skill point and stat points or pick different feats. Naturally, this'd require some thought due to feat prerequisites and, for example, using crafting feats and making armours and weapons before getting rid of them, but changing things over time could just become part of the game. (Early feats generally don't lose their usefulness, too, so dumping one in exchange for a later one won't always be an improvement unless you've been changing your tactics, making the feat a wasted one)
3. Rebalance the game
Take another look at the difficulties and rewards. Personally, I think it is best if a game is balanced for a level achieved by finishing about half of the extra content. People who like a challenge can rush, people who like things more leisurely can complete everything. The maximum achievable level should be accounted for, but not necessarily hard-capped. With the current reward level, it feels like level 25 will be the -minimum- level by the end. If level 35 is the effective maximum you would be completing all the side missions, balance the end for level 30. If there is a cap, make sure it's hard to achieve.
4. Make it an option
I've seen this suggested before and I think it's a valid idea. Another idea could be to make it part of the difficulty setting; hard would have a cap of 25, but it'd be higher or capless for the easier difficulties. The bigger challenge would still be in the game, then, for those who enjoyed the limitations of the cap.
5. XP as currency
This is a major one, so I don't expect to see it used, but I still wanted to add it in. After level 25, allow XP to be invested into something else. My personal choice would be increasing the grade of equipment and crafting materials. Perhaps even allow it to be invested into skills and feats in large quantities.
The key of all these points is to not make progress useless. As I said, once the level cap is reached, most actions become pointless and, on a replay, that knowledge makes anything extra feel pointless from the start as well. I think the game would feel kinder to new players and more replayable by raising the level cap in whichever way.
I really do enjoy the game otherwise. The limitations on carrying and bartering make things feel a bit more real and tactical. I love exploring random caves and locations and the map is rather sizeable. The different options for builds seem fairly balanced so far, the crafting system is interesting, it's been a while since I last really enjoyed a stealth-focused build and I enjoy actually having to employ tactics again and make smart builds. But once my progress halts, my enjoyment vanishes. I don't want to just hope I did well enough with my build and face challenges for their own sake; I want to keep building.
As said, I can appreciate wanting to keep challenge in the game and not letting players become too god-like, even if I enjoy it, but I personally play RPGs to keep advancing. I was just trying to see if there's a way we can have it both ways.
If you've actually managed to read this far: Thank you for your time!
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