I'm going to make one hail mary patch feedback, and shut the fuck up after this. This is really a copy and paste from my post from here:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/250520/discussions/0/2797251375477334477/https://underrail.com/forums/index.php?topic=5732.msg30350#msg30350
The first major theme of this update is the change to psi mechanics. The full changes are listed below. They are not primarily meant to kick the full psi builds down a notch (though they will do that), but to address the following issues with psi that I find the most problematic and detrimental to the game as a whole, not just in terms of difficulty:
Psi gives you too many utilities. Due to how the psi functions now (prior to this update) it's almost impossible to add new stuff to psi without extending the already bloated spectrum of combat utilities of any given psi generalist (which most psi builds are) even further, since, unlike with combat utilities, there are no limits to what a psi invoker can access during combat.
Psi is cheap to spec into. Even though every psi school is a separate skill, they are all based on a single base ability, which is the only one required to be maxed out in order for your character to be powerful. If you invest heavily enough into it, the psi abilities themselves will make up for many deficiencies in other areas. No other robust build works like this, they usually require at least moderately strong investment into a secondary base ability.
Psi does not require any expendable resource. Pretty much every other build does so I introduced a resource for psi as well. Now it has a dual (or hybrid if you will) resource management aspect. Also I used this opportunity to put a sort of a limit to how much psionic output you can dish out in a single fight, so we'll see how this works out.
This is the least important point, but it's still worth addressing. Some abilities are a bit too cheesey and easy to exploit so I changed them up a bit. This does not make them perfectly balanced or un-cheeseable and I know there is other stuff out there that's cheese as well. These are just the ones that bothered me the most and were long overdue to change.
If you refer to the above quote, the purpose of innervation are:
1) Psi have access to too many utilities.
2) It's impossible to add new stuff to psi
3) Psi is way too cheap to spec into: You only need high WIL and 6 INT for Premeditation
4) Psi does not require any expendable resource
5) Some psi abilities (again, hereafter refer to as spells) are way too cheesey/powerful
If you re-read my post #18 on this thread you'll see that I already said non-core spells are now window dressings. Whether the spells I listed are worthless or not are always up to debate. @Tamiore, in fact, you agree w/ me some spells are just not good enough to justify a slot. By default, the innervation slot system will screen out some spells as non-core spells, making Purpose #2 pointless. I already said as such:
This is at least 9 psi abilities out of 32 available that will never get use due to opportunity cost at a staggering rate of 28.125%. Styg you said you want to expand the psi system, but what's the point of adding new spell if it'll either:
1) never get use because slots are valuable and it's simply not good enough to make the loadout, or
2) It's very good and a must have to be included squeezing another spell out of loadout making the old spell effectively window dressing
Again, this point was never addressed nor acknowledged by Styg and rarely seen in any discussion unless I bring it up.
Now onto purpose #1, 3, 4, 5: this is exactly why under the old system psi is newbie friendly: easy to build, learn and use, with a vast array of spells to choose from. Another newbie friendly build is tin can AR build and I frequently hear complaints that it is boring: burst, burst and more burst. Psi was never boring; it allows shenanigans which makes it fun. This is important and not just a moot point as it made Underrail more accessible to new players. The whole point of making a game for a dev is to make $. The whole point of playing a game for player is to have fun. When a game is hard, boring, frustrating with a high barrier of entry, than it is unlikely to sell a lot of units = less $.
With the new slots system, you are going to be doing the same core spells over and over again, which is more boring = less fun => I do not know why some of you do not seem to understand that.
For the record, I am not a fan of innervation. However since the system is here to stay I want non innervated spells to play a role and allow to be use every once in awhile (under restrictions and within limits), not an extra slot.
Styg seems to see purpose #1, 3, 4 as a bad thing. I see them as a good thing but it's his game so ...
I agree w/ purpose #5 and some spells should be adjust accordingly.
Originally posted by destroyor:
- Cryo-Shield
Never used it before. Because opportunity costs was already too high in the form of psi/AP cost.
You missed out. You can pre-cast cryo-shield + PSP before you manually start a hard fight so the AP costs are irreverent, meaning two extra layers of "free" defense. Under the new system, sure you can still pre cast them and than reset your slots but even if you are willing to spend the two psi inhalants this "solution" is bad because:
There's a very thin line between having challenging mechanics and annoying, extra tedious "work". .. breaking game flow making it annoying. .. but all these changes and the design philosophy behind them, imho, had crossed this line and ventured firmly into annoying, tedious territory making the game feels like work sometimes and do not, again imho, increase the fun and challenge of the game. This trend is indeed worrying especially with Infusion currently under development and I suspect Styg is using Underrail as a test bed for future system.
So now to have the same effect you need to spend oh my god 2 extra inhalants /s and click click click click click - fucking tedious. At the very bare minimum there should be a streamline option for this - use a non-innervated spell, auto consume 2 psi inhalant without the multiple clicks + annoying loadout adjustments.
Variety to gameplay is like spices to food: They are not necessary but sure made the food a hell lot more enjoyable.
If you are serious about this discussion and genuinely interested on patch feedback, you should review all existing patch feedback threads. It could be here, steam forum, reddit, and what have you. You will find that I am not alone in believing psi was fun to play, a strong selling point for Underrail and this latest patch reduce this fun factor. You can laugh and dismiss this as a non issue all you want; Maybe Styg never intended psi to be this way, but we are not alone on this opinion, nor are we the minority. There are dozens of us! DOZENS!
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