More dialogs, more quests, more life !

[Ruvon]

Hi,

I know it's only an alpha version so far, but here are the things that somehow undermine my pleasure (only one thing actually, but happens a lot ^^) :

There's not enough quest and dialogs at this point. It seems a little bit empty.

I'd like more background info, maybe an intro ? I suppose there's a storyline with a beginning and an end, but so far it's like : you're a member of our station, do as I say, you don't need to know why, or if it will have any consequences. People don't talk to you about what you done for them, or didn't do for them (wich is actually better). You don't have a word to say about what you have to do, and that's a big issue : i'ts a really linear game. One-way story makes good or even great adventures games, not RPG. Or maybe these so called RPG from Japan for console players... but we all know that we can't call that RPG... Do we ?

The suggestion of Major_Blackheart goes the same way as mine here : http://underrail.com/forums/index.php?topic=325.0, although his idea is more precise and specific (and interesting by the way). My point de vue about almost the same situation, and what I meant by more dialogs is quite well explained by this example :

When you meet Gorsky at GMS Coumpound in front of the gate, he tells you to go find the key. But if you come back to him after meeting the bandits down there, you can't tell him anything about them. Same if you kill all of them, rescue the previous owners, not a word to him or to Tanner. There's a whole place ready to live in, maybe enemies to fight, even people to recruit for the SGS station, but nothing.
Just a few words, maybe an explanation in dialogs of why Gorsky or Tanner don't give a damn about that would make the whole thing more immersive by just adding a few sentences.
And you could expand this to the infinite and beyond.
Another example is the first quest you've been given : what's next after you powered up the stations in the cave and eradicated the rathounds ? What's the use for these ? What about the living guy with rathound pets ?

I repeat myself, but I must be clear : I know it's not a final version. I guess there is cool stuff behind the impossible to open doors. But please, don't forget about the story you're telling, because that's really the only disappointing thing in this alpha version.

I'm not asking for this kind of depth : http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/inxile/wasteland-2/posts/412225 (see the part about the keyword dialog system), but according to the story of the man who doesn't get old in the junkyard, you can write interesting background. Expand this skill to the quests !

Give this amazing project the content he needs. Graphics can keep that old-style look and your game can still become a reference for a generation if the universe feels real, alive, with interaction, with consequences, with choices (my dream would be a game with events happening because they're meant to, not because the player triggered them, and he can miss some events if he's not in the right place at the right time, wich can be a choice too... but I'm a dreamer).

In my opinion, it's more important than new ennemies design or improving the animations or smoothing the interface font or the graphics.
I know it's a big challenge, a hard work, and maybe you're already on it, proving me wrong.
But I also know I'm not the only one interested by this kind of content, so keep up the good work, and look : we're here to help.

[Clawdius_Talonious]

The game as it stands is more of a vertical slice than a demo of the game as it will be on release. While I can't speak for Styg, I do know if he implemented all of the content that will be available, including every path through every extant quest, some of the fans wouldn't have as much fun when playing through the early game post release. Given what he has managed to do so far, I'm going to hold some faith that what we're allowed to play with is more about getting us some content to promote the game and allow him to take an iterative design approach than demonstrating the sorts of interplay between abilities and dialog options and the like.

If I am correct in that assumption, and the game as we've been able to play it is more for feedback purposes, then we should all be very happy with the end result. While a vertical slice may not seem like a huge amount of content, getting all the features functional can represent a huge percentage of the work required to get the game up and running. Fleshing out content only to have some features meet with little approval from the fan base can be counter productive. An iterative development process can be very beneficial in that regard, even Wasteland 2 is benefiting from fan feedback, vis-

[maheusz]

Ah I would also add that there was an idea that people could help in writing all sorts of memos, e-mails and other miscellanious stuff, because Styg is only one guy. The same with naming all NPCs in the game, creating at least few things for them to say - you must hunt for the post somewhere here on the forums.

Yet for now the stance is that Styg first must start with creating more complicated world, adding more lore and then maybe we'll get to create a bits and pieces to add. Which is lovely idea for me . So... stay hopeful!

[Major_Blackhart]

Well, my examples ought to be good. I am a codexer after all.
But beyond that, I certainly do enjoy the options of an intranet, electronic articles reporting on changes made (by the PC as well as others) based on the success of the missions, and an e-mail system where after you complete something, people will send you e-mails offering congrats, or maybe ask you to stop by sometime for some work (like that one smuggler character in the Cantina who asks you to move a package for him).
I like the idea of a smuggling group sending you an e-mail on occasion, asking you to do this or that, giving you a drop off mission or something like that, once in a while.

I also like the idea of checking e-mails as a way of knowing who to talk to about getting a reward. I.E. the guys in the GMC compound send you a message thanking them after you save a few of them, and ask you to put in a word to Tanner about them joining up with the South Side station, in exchange the station gets access to all their resources. Then, you go to Tanner and convince him of the merits of those people (persuasion or just a good enough rep with Tanner. If you have high enough persuasion, it's a done deal. If not, you rely on your rep, which means that you won't be able to get them to join until later on).

They could reward you not only with credits, and some other items, but also with some sort of a secret, like an experimental power generator that requires low electronics but gives off a higher level of quality (i.e. quality is like 70-80 but the electronics requirement is only 30-40). Something unique maybe like that. Or access to an assault rifle frame that is 12.7mm capable. Who knows really. But these are ideas.

On the subject of e-mails, I like the idea of a reward system of some sort based on merits you perform. Like a little bonus in some way. I think it would be preferred if it's not shop keepers but random people with names, like the engineers assistant or that one blind guy's assisstant, or a guard upstairs by the security station, etc.

I would definitely like to help out with that stuff if I could. Let me know Styg.

[Major_Blackhart]

Another thing: I know you said the burrowers are entirely optional, but at the same time, having someone contact you after dealing with a few would be great.

I like the idea of receiving an e-mail after giving proof to Gorsky that you killed a few, earning his respect. This is some random dude in the southern station, a named character that has no dialogue. His e-mail talks about how he lost a few family members to the burrowers, but never had the courage to get some payback on them himself. He wants you to give him maybe a dozen of their poison glands, for trophies, as a way of honoring his family.

You see him, give them to him. Only afterwards you find out, maybe by reading his e-mails or finding out from someone else, that he works for Tanner and Gorsky doing wetwork, killing anyone who 'gets in their way', especially foreigners who try to interfere in the Southside station internal workings and politics.

You can confront Tanner and Gorsky about this, as well as the assassin, and offer to your services, or claim that you're going to tell everyone about it as you're disgusted by their behavior. Only problem is, when you do tell people in the station, they seem not to care, though some more influential members are apalled by these tactics. They can threaten Gorsky and Tanner with removal if things aren't stopped. But there are also other consequences to ending assassinations. Those are that now, other stations and outposts are much more aggressive with the Southern Station, and supplies are now slimmer and slimmer (i.e. not as many high quality goods as early on, and raw materials are fewer in inventories which replenish at a slower rate).

It opens up a good way to change things around in the Southside Station, as well as opening up other avenues for the player. If you do take on the role of assassin for instance, there are several types: quiet killer, booby traps (heh, booby), and the bloody valentine type (massacre everyone). Obviously the highest paying one is the bloody valentine type, because it makes people fear and respect the Southside station, and that means that more supplies of a much higher quality are available earlier on, etc. The quiet killer and booby trapper are both good as well, but each less so, etc. because they don't bring a reputation to the station like the Bloody Valentine type killer.
Think the difference between Carmine Galante and Angelo Bruno, two American Mafia dons from the east coast who did business very differently but at the same time both were murdered by subordinates. (Not the best example for long term sustainability, but still).
But with the reputation of a bloody valentine type killer comes other problems, like bounties and young hoods out to make a name for themselves.

[Ruvon]

That's the spirit Major_Blackhart !

Your ideas sounds very interesting to me, I'd like to know what Styg think about all this.

I would definitely like to help out with that stuff if I could. Let me know Styg.

Me too 

[Styg]

While I respect your enthusiasm and some of those ideas that you've presented are pretty good, the reason this sort of stuff is not in the game ain't lack of ideas. While the amount of quests, flavor dialog, background info, and such will increase over time (especially in SGS areas) do not expect it to reach near-simulation level of realism where every quest is linked to every other and everyone will react to everything you do. Nothing near that is viable.

As for fan-made content, I do not accept any volunteer work as a rule (though I might steal your ideas!). We talked before about some minor stuff like misc. documents and minor background stuff the fans could offer to the game, so that might happen but I'm not sure. We'll see.

[maheusz]

I found the post where we discuss lore/journals addition:

http://underrail.com/forums/index.php?topic=135.0