Stealth character - SMG or Xbow?

[Infiltrator]

Hey, so I want to make a stealth character, but I'm curious how they pan out playing later on.

My basis is this - smg, low str/con, max dex and go with throwing grenades, crafting (everything but biology) hit n run, supressive fire, opportunst, commando and basically dump all on burst mode. Invest in dodge/evasion later. However I am concerned with how this character would deal with people using bulletproof vests, especially those that are burn immune so I can't CC them with molotovs. I guess I should look for a jaguar + muzzle break + smart module + 5 or 7 mil?

The other build is xbow, again dump str/con but focus on perception and the obvious traps. Maybe try throwing without putting points in it, but not sure, xbows seem to really struggle early on and molotovs are the bread and butter to control enemies. I guess perk selection is obvious here, just trap and xbow synergy. Here I'd get the zephyr because of highest  crit multiplier coupled with anatomically aware scope and super string, very obvious choice. Though I have no clue what to get as a 2nd xbow.

What do you think the perks of each playstyle are and how do you think they fair later in the game?

[mattu]

I've never played a SMG character. Have plans to sometime after the expansion comes out.

I've played a couple of xbow chars all the way through. I think they're a lot of fun. Don't expect to mow down enemies in groups. You don't need to kill everything on the map (or anything, sometimes).

I agree with epeli that it's all about the special bolts (and the traps, and the stealth).

That said, there is a useful design for 2nd crossbow that spoiled/system savvy people often take. You might notice it for yourself or you can search on crossbow builds and one of them will mention it. Kinda neat but definitely not required--I didn't know about it or figure it out my first playthrough and got along OK.

Re grenades, I might have chucked a couple molotovs in the very early part of the game but traps are the cc alternative for an xbower. Quick Tinkering is what saves you when you screw up.

[Infiltrator]

If you wish to use SMGs stealthily, your primary weapon is going to be a silenced 5mm and the single most important feat Expertise. Secondary weapon probably 8.6mm with barrel compensator or rapid reloader. Smart modules for both because they're just silly powerful. Armor isn't an issue since W2C rounds exist and high caliber SMGs are pretty much pocket assault rifles. If you worry about CC, taser and flashbangs should be all you will ever need on top of molotovs.

The perks of SMGs - crazy high damage output, very simple to play. That's just the way it is with automatic firearms.

The perks of crossbows - they are hardcore! Sometimes just picking a crossbow feat may crash the game or destroy your character. Doesn't get any more hardcore than that! Jokes aside, crossbows are fun & unique playstyle, second only to tri-discipline psionics in terms of tactical variety. The popular belief is that crossbows suck, but don't let that fool you. They only suck if you compare them to... any other means of offense. Or try to use them like you would... any other weapon. No but really seriously now crossbows aren't as bad as people make them be. They do need crafting to support them, but then again crafting is amazing boon for any character. So that's not really a downside. And about your obvious crossbow choices... well, frankly I don't use any of them. The sooner you realize that a crossbow is not a weapon itself, but a special bolt delivery device, the less painful your life as a crossbowski will be.

The supressor does lower the damage output, and the 5mm is pretty pitiful to begin with? You sure this one can work as a primary weapon? I mean the compensator adds 2 extra bullets during burst on top of them not being damage-impaired, meaning you are getting much more from bursts right? Or is there something else about supressors other than not attracting enemies that I don't know about? And what would you say the best variant is? Jaguar to squeeze the max amount of bursts per turn?

As for crossbows, I know they aren't bad, they just need a bit to get going compared to the other stuff. You can one-shot a lot of things properly built but it seems like everything depends on whether or not you land a single shot. If you miss everything just falls apart (even with quick tinkering).

[TΛPETRVE]

Crossbows are like Maliwan weapons in Borderlands. Focusing on elemental damage, rather than raw physical.

[Fenix]

If you wish to use SMGs stealthily, your primary weapon is going to be a silenced 5mm and the single most important feat Expertise. Secondary weapon probably 8.6mm with barrel compensator or rapid reloader. Smart modules for both because they're just silly powerful. Armor isn't an issue since W2C rounds exist and high caliber SMGs are pretty much pocket assault rifles. If you worry about CC, taser and flashbangs should be all you will ever need on top of molotovs.

The perks of SMGs - crazy high damage output, very simple to play. That's just the way it is with automatic firearms.

The perks of crossbows - they are hardcore! Sometimes just picking a crossbow feat may crash the game or destroy your character. Doesn't get any more hardcore than that! Jokes aside, crossbows are fun & unique playstyle, second only to tri-discipline psionics in terms of tactical variety. The popular belief is that crossbows suck, but don't let that fool you. They only suck if you compare them to... any other means of offense. Or try to use them like you would... any other weapon. No but really seriously now crossbows aren't as bad as people make them be. They do need crafting to support them, but then again crafting is amazing boon for any character. So that's not really a downside. And about your obvious crossbow choices... well, frankly I don't use any of them. The sooner you realize that a crossbow is not a weapon itself, but a special bolt delivery device, the less painful your life as a crossbowski will be.

Ahaha, I suspect that this hilarious pic has its roots in forum, as other stuff in game.

[NEvercalled]

i play AR stealth . Doctor belt + AR.
Pure SMG is not bad but u need much more ammo and reload belt. And of coz 7 str anyway when u use bursts. And on SMG i go 2 modules to accuracy. Found it just better.


BTW why the hell stealth is so OP in that game? Even on heavy armor guys it is useful.

[Infiltrator]

I guess AP bullets are for high mechanical DR enemies, but what about crossbows? How do you kill bladelings with them? Poison and run away seems a bit slow?

[mattu]

Shock bolts Mk II+ were my answer to bladelings (and robots), and I felt them adequate.

If you happen to be facing multiple bladelings (or anything) at once, and you have the Deadly Snares feat, the crit bonus applies to shock bolt splash damage along with the main damage. Sometimes this is noticeable.

[destroyor]

For my crossbow char Acid Blob Trap is the answer to bladelings.

[mattu]

I never messed around with Acid Blob Traps much (*), but I will observe that acid bolts will also do ya against bladelings, should you be short on shock bolts for some reason.

(* I'm settling into the opinion that bear traps are all you really need. Sometimes you need a lot of them, but damn the humble bear trap is good. Kinda hoping for some flying enemies by and by.)

[NEvercalled]

bladelings are so slow that u can just kill them slowly one by one

[addictedorc]

I play stealth, I use X-bow as my alternate with a sniper rifle as a primary (serious penalties for using a sniper rifle when a hostile is adjacent to you, and the rifle is noisy so it will draw in more enemies), with heavy tactical use of traps, terrain, and movement.  The synergy between crossbows and traps is potent and should not be under-estimated. The varied types of bolts means added versatility I can't get with a sniper rifle. Note the X-bow is a 2 handed weapon, and SMG is one handed.  If you're planning on using armor with a shield, go SMG. My one regret is that you can't combine special bolt attacks with special attacks (aimed shot with a shock bolt) for instance.

**If I am wrong about the special bolt attack and special attack someone please say so and how to do it**