Author Topic: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question  (Read 13141 times)

`louse`

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2020, 07:20:08 am »
Admittedly, before the fix, the psy looked like imba. And these changes, in my opinion, have benefited the game, i.e. complicated it. Admit to yourself that going through something more difficult will get more fun than a light jog.

UnLimiTeD

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2020, 09:43:41 am »
3) Well pure psi is real bad now,
This is provably false. Some players still do dominating ironman runs with pure PSI with little to no problems.
Those two statements don't contradict each other.
A) Some people can probably do dominating with really bad equipment, yet good equipment is still helpful, and necessary for most players in most situations. What is useful for the vast majority may still work for some people.
B) Some psi abilities are really good, and repeatable. But the update takes away versatility (purposfully so), so while it didn't hit, or just slightly nerfed, some of the better abilities (though some of them got hit quite hard), it diminished the efficiency of other abilities.

I assume for me it just added a lot of tedium (reinnervating), but I can understand that the high end needed to be balanced.
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`louse`

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2020, 01:39:32 pm »

Compromise or not,  it addresses directly two types of complains
1) "Don't change rules in the middle of a play-though.".
2) "The game was much better before the patch, just let me keep playing that."
1) The fact is that most have already completed the game. And the sequel is unknown when it will be released, and perhaps it will be a separate game.
2) And who forbids whom to play the old version? In addition, whoever wanted - he left it for himself long ago.

Tamior

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2020, 04:16:34 pm »
3) Well pure psi is real bad now,
This is provably false. Some players still do dominating ironman runs with pure PSI with little to no problems.
Those two statements don't contradict each other.
A) Some people can probably do dominating with really bad equipment, yet good equipment is still helpful, and necessary for most players in most situations. What is useful for the vast majority may still work for some people.
B) Some psi abilities are really good, and repeatable. But the update takes away versatility (purposfully so), so while it didn't hit, or just slightly nerfed, some of the better abilities (though some of them got hit quite hard), it diminished the efficiency of other abilities.

I assume for me it just added a lot of tedium (reinnervating), but I can understand that the high end needed to be balanced.
I can agree that pure psions are somewhat less versatile after the update.
But they are nowhere near being "real bad".
Pure psion is still one of the strongest builds overall.


1) The fact is that most have already completed the game. And the sequel is unknown when it will be released, and perhaps it will be a separate game.
2) And who forbids whom to play the old version? In addition, whoever wanted - he left it for himself long ago.
1) There are always some players that haven't completed their current run.
2) Um, that's the WHOLE POINT of having a separate legacy branch. Unless such branch exists, the game will simply automatically and irreversibly update to the newest version.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2020, 04:19:22 pm by Tamior »

Meladonimi

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2020, 05:30:39 pm »
3) Well pure psi is real bad now,
This is provably false. Some players still do dominating ironman runs with pure PSI with little to no problems.
Those two statements don't contradict each other.
A) Some people can probably do dominating with really bad equipment, yet good equipment is still helpful, and necessary for most players in most situations. What is useful for the vast majority may still work for some people.
B) Some psi abilities are really good, and repeatable. But the update takes away versatility (purposfully so), so while it didn't hit, or just slightly nerfed, some of the better abilities (though some of them got hit quite hard), it diminished the efficiency of other abilities.

I assume for me it just added a lot of tedium (reinnervating), but I can understand that the high end needed to be balanced.
I can agree that pure psions are somewhat less versatile after the update.
But they are nowhere near being "real bad".
Pure psion is still one of the strongest builds overall.


1) The fact is that most have already completed the game. And the sequel is unknown when it will be released, and perhaps it will be a separate game.
2) And who forbids whom to play the old version? In addition, whoever wanted - he left it for himself long ago.
1) There are always some players that haven't completed their current run.
2) Um, that's the WHOLE POINT of having a separate legacy branch. Unless such branch exists, the game will simply automatically and irreversibly update to the newest version.
Bad =/= weak. I just dont like swap psi deck evry 5 mins and care tonns of inhalators at bag. it is just nasty.
With slots was needed change psi skills as well. Old deck was have high cd, and this was fair, now... with slots it is anoing.
Just more comfort now play at other builds, they much fun now.

Kiki

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #20 on: September 03, 2020, 03:05:15 am »
At first I saw this update as something horrible that would completely take away the versatility of the psyche, but then I realized that this update was very important to nerf the psyche that were really mutating.
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`louse`

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #21 on: September 03, 2020, 05:03:22 am »
1) The fact is that most have already completed the game. And the sequel is unknown when it will be released, and perhaps it will be a separate game.
2) And who forbids whom to play the old version? In addition, whoever wanted - he left it for himself long ago.
1) There are always some players that haven't completed their current run.
2) Um, that's the WHOLE POINT of having a separate legacy branch. Unless such branch exists, the game will simply automatically and irreversibly update to the newest version.
1 and 2) I don't know how it is on steam, but GOG has a stationary version of the game that will not be updated as needed. And those who have not yet completed the game can use it.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2020, 05:06:00 am by `louse` »

Wrath of Dagon

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #22 on: September 03, 2020, 04:54:12 pm »
Last I checked Steam forces you to update.

Pruvan

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #23 on: September 03, 2020, 08:52:12 pm »
Last I checked Steam forces you to update.

See attachment.

Tamior

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #24 on: September 03, 2020, 08:58:03 pm »
Last I checked Steam forces you to update.

See attachment.
What you just posted proves that steam forces you to update by default.
All option in that list are branches that developer manually added. I.e. if "Legacy" wasn't added manually, it wouldn't have been an option.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2020, 08:59:42 pm by Tamior »

Pruvan

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #25 on: September 03, 2020, 09:01:55 pm »
What you just posted proves that steam forces you to update by default.
All option in that list are branches that developer explicitly added.

Ah sorry I misread that, I thought there was confusion on whether or not legacy would be possible on Steam. My bad.

If I'm not mistaken though, turning on the option in this attachment and then running underrail.exe directly from the Underrail folder prevents Steam from updating the game unless you run it through Steam again. In case that's something people want. This works for most games on Steam.

Tamior

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #26 on: September 03, 2020, 10:19:11 pm »
If I'm not mistaken though, turning on the option in this attachment and then running underrail.exe directly from the Underrail folder prevents Steam from updating the game unless you run it through Steam again. In case that's something people want. This works for most games on Steam.
Sure, but most players will get an auto-update first, and only then realize that they may not like the new system all that much.
At which point without a legacy branch there wouldn't be an option to go back to the previous version.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2020, 10:44:42 pm by Tamior »

spleen.ii

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #27 on: September 04, 2020, 02:11:10 pm »
I really liked the way psi worked before and I'm a bit sad about the changes, but I must admit you really care about the game's community and our feedbacks. You really try to find compromises, it is not an easy task and it's... Not common.

So, thank for that. I though it was important to mention it.

Merfix

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #28 on: September 04, 2020, 06:32:15 pm »
what armor is that

Call The Banners

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Re: Dev Log #68: The Psi Question
« Reply #29 on: September 07, 2020, 03:20:20 pm »
I've owned the game for a while but got discouraged when I tried it a while back. Since then there's been a heap load of QoL changes and a bloody expansion even. I've been playing the game for about 5 days now and I'm loving it. Any new addition or tweak to the game is fine for me. I actually don't run any psi on my current playthrough but it would see I should try it out now.

I'm patiently waiting for my steam client to show me the update is live.