Some thought after let's plays

[Fenix]

So, I watched let's play (the one I actually posted early) and have some.

So, that guy played a sniper path\build - something I completely avoiding all the time because it was the first thing I tried in UnderRail. It was long-long ago, so I completely forgot that frustrating feeling lol.
But the video remembered that to me - and now it is obvious, after all other builds I played\watched, that way sniper rifle is the weakest in game.
Even crossbows, which was designed as pure support weapon is much stronger and more satisfactory way of play, wich is obvious from same let's play.

Sniper rifles have nothing - they shoot 1 (!) time in turn, which is awfully horrible, they have movement penalty, close combat penalty, they have stat requirements.
I hesitate to say what they actually have.
Huge damage?
I don't know which damage numbers have end-game snipers, but thats obviously not enough, because they suck hard vs many enemies at once - they should move-->they lose precision.
It's not that I have some interest in that way of play, I said that for the sake of truth and in the desire to make the game better.

Second - crossbows are support weapon, but someone will play with them as main weapon without doubt.
So here a couple of things to make such way easier.
I noted that special bolts kept in inventory in stacks of five.
It's just clutter up the entire inventory when someone done a good craft like 20 bolts of every kind.
Don't know why it needed to be that way. Let's it be at least 25 in stack in inventory (foe pure example).
Also, I think 5 bolts in belt slot is too few for long fights.
Maybe some feat, for example Special Tactics would also give not 5, but 6 or 7 bolts in belt slots? Because this feat already have not much use now, because it should be activated before fight, which is boring to do in (before) every fight, so most of the time it's just dead weight.

Just a couple of thoughts...

[Fenix]

I skimmed through nerdcommando's sniper video and noticed he didn't even once showcase the most powerful trick of stealth builds: Disengaging from combat with restealth. I don't know if he demonstrates it in his other videos, but I doubt that since he didn't do it here. Remember the point halfway through the video where he had trouble with three ironheads? Snipe one, throw a flashbang at the other two, enter stealth mode and end combat. Repeat for the second kill if necessary. I was also surprised to see he didn't use night vision goggles with such a long range weapon! He would've had 95% precision at long ranges, instead of 60% and something. That's quite literally day and night difference, especially so when you depend on powerful and slow single shots. Not to mention easy 15%+ damage from low level smart goggles - stealth from balaclava doesn't quite compare.

It is all true what you said. But all other builds can do the same and in the end they still have much more than sniper.
Pistolero and psi and kung-fu panda can do it, and stil can be better.

- There are rifles that can shoot twice per turn, unique SVD and craftable Spearhead with rapid reloader. Other low to medium caliber rifles with rapid reloader can also be shot twice with Adrenaline, and for a sniper combat rarely lasts longer than adrenaline does, so you can be total junkie!

It is aslo true, but even crossbows can shoot three times under adrenaline, and they have special bolts with disables\CC immediately. I even don't say about crazy cost of every fight for sniper in this case.

- IMO their penalties are welcome. Makes using them more tactical and rewarding. Also consider that combat mechanics are bilateral in Underrail - enemies have to deal with the same penalties.

They have too much of it it seems to me. Too many penalties in one field.

- Well, their STR requirement (5) is lower than pistols (6 for feats) or assault rifles (7).

But that's for feat, and those for nothing.

The above are fine IMO, that's the way sniper rifles are designed to be. But unfortunately, even with their higher AP costs, they lose to pistols in this whole "one shot, one kill" business, which I assume is supposed to be the ultimate strength of snipers.

They feels like worst weapon in game - slow, penalized for close-combat and in general as very unsatisfactory way to play.

And let's talk about feats: there are 8 feats specifically for pistols. 8 for SMGs. 7 for assault rifles. 7 for crossbows. And for sniper rifles... wait for it... 3 feats! One of those is passive (Sharpshooter) and other (Snipe) is made largely redundant by Critical Power enhanced Aimed Shots. Yeah, sniper rifles could use some love before release. Overwatch type ability or passive as a level 14 feat could be interesting and unique? Kinda like Commando in the way that you could get a free follow-up shot.

Something definitely should to be done. Don't know - maybe better crafting options, some new feats, we need a brainstorming session.

Special bolts being limited to stacks of 5 makes crossbowski the only character ever who actually 1) needs to think about utility loadout before battles, 2) can run out of utilities during combat and 3) should consider taking Quick Pockets. I really like that and wish other builds had to carefully consider their loadout like that.

You are right but I don't see any reason not to give them at least +1 bolt per slot with some feat, because a end-game fights are much more roug, and Special Tactics feels fine for that.

But I agree special bolt stacks could be larger, perhaps 10 like grenades. You're going to be limited to 2-5 different types of bolts in any case and that upgrade would fit Special Tactics thematically.

It can fit the other feat as well, because Special Tactics alredy busy with belt slot's stack increase. ))))
Seriously, why 10, why not 25?
I know that infinite stack looks and feels cheap, and I agree wuth that with both hands, but imagine 100 special bolts, cluttering inventory for no reason? It alredy has enough of scrolling.
Maybe we should buy a quiver of some post-apocalyptic kind? Just like the compass.

[Fenix]

Well, I read all topic about Underrail on RPGcodex (not all bit last dozen of pages), and I'll see that someone alredy wrote the same, and I saw your answer. )
So, crossbows will probably get some attention, it is good.