Thoughts on 5/5 spec'ed disassemble.

[TheAverageGortsby]

My problem with Thermodynamicity and Pyromaniac is that both are heavily random.
[...]
On tranquility psion I rarely find it optimal to alternate between fire and ice. 95% of the time I would prefer to either just spam ice, or use something from psychokinesis and/or thought control. Getting a good AP cost reduction on something I don't actually want to do most of the time (alternate between fire and ice, that is) is redundant.

Mmm.  You don't sequence your abilities well, then.  Chill is a fairly weak debuff; burning is one of the strongest debuffs against living enemies - it's the only DoT + fear, I think.  So what you'd want to do is open with, say, a premeditated cold ability like Cryo Orb, then use Pyrokinesis, pick off a survivor with Cryokinesis, and if you're dealing with a huge mass of enemies, then place a ThermoD, proxy a TK Punch for the ThermoD kill, Cryokinesis to kill anything that's not yet dead or on fire, and pop a psi booster then throw a grenade.  All that in one turn is no problem with Thermodynamicity.

It's even often nice when you're not using Metathermics as your primary output, since it lasts a turn. You can cryo shield yourself one turn, immolate the next, and do all that in the little sliver of AP you leave yourself between double Electrokinesis each turn, or Implosions, or whatever.  Industrial Robots are no threat at all - literally zero threat - if you can walk two squares and be immune to fire, so a few fights that could otherwise get hairy become predictable and safe.  Crawlers of any sort are loath to get up close when you're surrounded by fire, so you can make some ruckus, start burning, and then have a low-AP Cryo Orb to reveal crawlers in a huge area once you've given them a turn to get close - then with the rest of your AP, and a quick-cast Pyrokinesis, you can manage a room with no risk to yourself.

There's nothing random about Thermodynamicity.  It's best against large groups, or extremely tough enemies, and isn't something that you use in every single fight, unlike Premeditation, but it's top-tier if you play to it.

[destroyor]

Meditation with +psi pool feats and equipment from expedition is now 100% redundant.

Well, just want to note expedition spirit staff was nerfed and no longer reduce psi cost.

[Tamior]

Meditation with +psi pool feats and equipment from expedition is now 100% redundant.

Well, just want to note expedition spirit staff was nerfed and no longer reduce psi cost.

Neither does Meditation.
The only thing Meditation is actually good for is giving you enough of an increase to the psi points pool so that when you re-gain 100 points via psi booster nothing is "wasted".
Spirit stuff gives you +10 extra pool size, that almost always gets the job done just as well.

[Tamior]

Mmm.  You don't sequence your abilities well, then.  Chill is a fairly weak debuff; burning is one of the strongest debuffs against living enemies - it's the only DoT + fear, I think.  So what you'd want to do is open with, say, a premeditated cold ability like Cryo Orb, then use Pyrokinesis, pick off a survivor with Cryokinesis, and if you're dealing with a huge mass of enemies, then place a ThermoD, proxy a TK Punch for the ThermoD kill, Cryokinesis to kill anything that's not yet dead or on fire, and pop a psi booster then throw a grenade.  All that in one turn is no problem with Thermodynamicity.

OK, one thing at a time:
1) ThermoD into proxi'ed implosion and punch is more that enough to outright kill everything in it's AOE most of the time. No one is actually left alive for DOT's and fear to matter. You don't need Thermodynamicity for it to work any better. You also don't need Pyromaniac for ThermoD to set thing on fire (again, not that's it's relevant, since most things are just DEAD after getting hit by it). It's so insanely overpowered on it's own I literally stopped using it to keep the game more-or-less challenging.
2) Pyrokinesis and Cryo Orb can miss (and hit YOU if you are unlucky enough). Literally nothing else in psionics has THAT problem. And that's a HUGE problem when you limit your reloads.
3) Fear from fire may fail to proc when you need it to. Or it may proc and make the target run away crying for help -- drawing MORE enemies into the fight. Again, pretty major problem when you limit your reloads.
4) Fire-based metathermics abilities are LOUD. Meanwhile with just the TC and PK stuff you can easily kill stuff in a room without anyone in the room next door hearing anything.

It's even often nice when you're not using Metathermics as your primary output, since it lasts a turn. You can cryo shield yourself one turn, immolate the next, and do all that in the little sliver of AP you leave yourself between double Electrokinesis each turn, or Implosions, or whatever.  Industrial Robots are no threat at all - literally zero threat - if you can walk two squares and be immune to fire, so a few fights that could otherwise get hairy become predictable and safe.  Crawlers of any sort are loath to get up close when you're surrounded by fire, so you can make some ruckus, start burning, and then have a low-AP Cryo Orb to reveal crawlers in a huge area once you've given them a turn to get close - then with the rest of your AP, and a quick-cast Pyrokinesis, you can manage a room with no risk to yourself.

Nothing you described here really explains why I would want to alternate between ice and fire. If I want Exothermic Aura, I just cast that. Neither  Thermodynamicity nor Pyromaniac make it any better at what it does. And Cryo-Shield is just a really bad substitute for Pseudo-spatial Projection 95% of the time. Etc, etc.
TL;DR: I can pretty much guarantee that for any fight where alternating between fire and ice with Thermodynamicity seems useful I can come up with a strategy that does not include such heavy use of metathermics that will be even MORE reliable.

There's nothing random about Thermodynamicity.  It's best against large groups, or extremely tough enemies, and isn't something that you use in every single fight, unlike Premeditation, but it's top-tier if you play to it.

It's a "solution looking for a problem". Anything it can do, I can do better by not trying to alternate fire and ice. Name a fight where you think Thermodynamicity is good, and I'll show you how it's completely unnecessary.

[tyrtix]

just restarted a run with a hybrid psi-pistol, took disassemble myself too, ad just at the second level, because i already understood that i had little money and a single feat with no skill needed could be very very good to get money (thou i picked also a few points in pickpocket, will stop at 40 in this skill as i usually do).
I think you're right in saying this is a very underrated feat and the 5/5 spec makes it even better, and even more now that the repair kits had been nerfed so badly: i didn't made the math for that but i believe atm even in normal difficulty, recycling items to make repair kits and then sell them for a bit more of profit is not viable anymore, and i do want my toon not need to carry around 3-4 repair kits just to be efficient as he should with weapons.
To me, the nerf in repair kits is very bad, as it just leads to a full chain of things not used anymore: why buy recycle blueprint now, since i can sell these items i will recycle and then buy the kits i need?

[Tamior]

To be fair, recycling and repair kits still have their uses:
It still makes sense to recycle dirt cheap normal knives, or the gazillion rathound pelts (you can instantly craft simple leather armor, then recycle it on the spot).

[tyrtix]

Indeed you can, but on dominating, many building mats are worth more sold as is than in the new repair kit formula, or at least you will gain very little from the kits, but from my math, you actually loose something.
It may be worth if you have too many items and need money, thou there are plenty of leather or melee weapons buyers, so...

[Tamior]

Average piece of rathound leather has a value of ~200 and weights 5.0

When crafted into armor by itself, that armor has a value of ~500 and weights 5.0

When that armor is recycled, it gives you ~40 scrap fabric, so about half of advanced repair kit with value of 900, so about 450 of value and weight of ~2.0 when in scrap, and half that when crafted into repair kit

Conclusion: selling raw leather is almost never a good idea, selling crafted armor or repair kits is about equally good.
Since you can only sell a few of both at a time, it makes perfect sense to sell as much crafted suits of armor as you can, and recycle the rest into repair kits and sell those.



P.S.
There is a bit of extra complexity coming from the fact you need no skill in tailoring to sell raw leather, ~30 in tailoring to craft armor, and 50 in tailoring to craft advanced repair kits.

Also there are obvious weight considerations. Scrap/repair kits usually give you by far the best value-per-kilogram.

[HulkOSaurus]

And that's a HUGE problem when you limit your reloads.

[tyrtix]

i also make gloves with leather and other items like blades and spikes, wich is a very good way to make money easier from them, but yes, leather itself is worth less than the kit, while a knife is often worth more than the scraps you can get from it.
Best part of disassemble: you need to buy just 1 or 2 rapid reloaders, since when you need to craft a new weapon, you just disassemble the old one. Also: weapons crafted with more additional parts are worth more, sometimes a lot more even if you consider the loss of quality, and this works even better on weapons wich need repairs: add a laser sight or a spare magazine to the half broken pistol you got from the ironhead man, and sell it for a LOT more profit :3

In my actual run, for the moment, i don't have such big problems with money, thou beign an hybrid build, the psy abilities was a bit harder to get.

[Sykar]

And that's a HUGE problem when you limit your reloads.

Sure you do, especially when you try out new stuff. Why restart over and over? I would only restart if there is a situation where I have to save scum to progress at most if I feel like the experiment was a failure.

[Tamior]

No one is really of the opinion you shouldn't reload (on dominating, or any other difficulty, for that matter) if you feel like it.

The argument is that comparing builds without accounting for how "reload-heavy" they are is a bit besides the point, as with enough reloads you basically bypass a huge number of mechanics in the game (initiative rolls, random crits, random misfires, stealth, etc, etc).

[tyrtix]

tbh, most players plays by knowing already how many enemies and what kind of them they can find around, so after the first run, you get a great advantage from that. As i said elsewhere, based on the game mechanics, there are areas in wich you simply have either to know the enemy, or you need to reload. Example: i'm doing my first run on dominating, with an hybrid psy/pistol build with riot +shield and use of opportunist and cryo.
First time i got into the psy beetle to save the guy at warehouse, combat started the exact moment when i stepped foot into the external area of the warehouse. One psy win initiative, drops on me a cryo and crit with neural overload, for a total of near 60 damage. Character dead before i could even do anything. The only way i can possibly handle this is by just taking stealth, else i always have chances in wich i cannot scout area or combat starts in advance and i can't do anything but reload.

[Tamior]

tbh, most players plays by knowing already how many enemies and what kind of them they can find around, so after the first run, you get a great advantage from that. As i said elsewhere, based on the game mechanics, there are areas in wich you simply have either to know the enemy, or you need to reload.

You yourself later on point out that going into a new zone in stealth is also a perfectly viable third option.

[ciox]

Disassemble should be a common blueprint sold for a price or found in the world, like recycle, and not a feat.

Crafting components should have an additional data field that is normally hidden, when you disassemble an item, all the components have that field set to the item's durability.

When those components are put back together their data fields are read and you get an item that has the old durability instead of being magically fixed. If you sell the crafting components their sell value is adjusted according to the data field, so that again you can't magically fix components when selling them.