Author Topic: Spear/Versatility + Metathermics  (Read 4759 times)

Crows

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Spear/Versatility + Metathermics
« on: May 23, 2022, 11:51:55 pm »
Link to the build: https://underrail.info/build/?Hg4GAwcDBwYjIgDCoAAAAFJGNwBzczVQcwAAwqBGPABMK8KjJghfwpbClAbCkyRFVUsWEsK2fMKHwpzin4QB4qeCAuKzjgLita4F378

The premise is pretty straightforward - I'd like to be a reasonably tanky melee fighter while still retaining some mobility. My first attempt tried to meet the stat requirements for Stoicism as well as Sprint, and wound up having two barely-mediocre offensive options early on. Depot A was rough, since there just wasn't enough power behind the spear or the PSI. Despite killing The Beast on Dominating, I struggled to deal with more than a few human enemies at a time. The second attempt ditched CON and reallocated those points to STR, which performed better but it didn't capture what I was going for.

So now I'm going to do the real dumb thing and ditch AGI, giving up Sprint. Instead, I'm going to crank up Metathermics and take Versatility, giving me offensive options at short, medium, and long range. Hopefully PTC will be sufficient mobility - depending on how it feels, I might alter when I pick up Psycho-Temporal Acceleration.

Right now, I'm questioning whether I want to keep Nimble and Bodyweight Training. They'll ensure I'm not entirely immobile, but I'm wondering whether a pair of boot springs is better than the extra defense from a metal plate. If I dropped them, I'd pick up Dirty Kick and maybe Sixth Shell or Cryogenic Induction (for Cryostasis/Impale kills).



Suggestions are very welcome - the spear seemed like the best weapon to build a tank around, but I'm definitely open to switching things around.

Crows

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Re: Spear/Versatility + Metathermics
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2022, 06:58:11 pm »
Currently about halfway through Depot A. The early game was fairly difficult after retaking the outposts (especially since not a single Rathound dropped an ear) - at level 6 or 7 I tried taking on the Water Treatment Plant (Acolytes) along with the thugs and Siphoners next door, wound up getting clapped a few times. Things have smoothed out significantly since leveling to 9 and crafting a PSI tac vest and tungsten spear (and purchasing a few MKII frags). Cryostasis and a taser are working out well, although I miss Dirty Kick and am considering whether it's worth keeping Expose Weakness. I think Expose Weakness will pay off later, but a high strength/metal boots Dirty Kick leading into Impale is a pretty nice source of damage early game.

Starting stats were 8/6/3/7/3/7/6. If I were to run this again, I think I would redistribute a bit - something like 10/6/3/6/3/6/6 - just to bump early game hit chance. I haven't noticed much of an effect from Conditioning/Stoicism, largely because my HP isn't high enough yet and I don't have any Aegis to stack on top of it - it might be worth pushing them back a few levels and taking Nimble, maybe even Grenadier earlier. I also invested an early ~16-20 points into Chemistry for molotovs; I think it might have been better to just purchase them and use the points in either Mechanics or Tailoring to improve my armor/spear earlier. When I arrived at Junkyard I realized I was just a couple points below the Pickpocket threshold for Scrapper/Eel insignias, so that would have been another nice candidate.

Going forward, I'm contemplating finalizing my stats at 15/6/3/7/3/7/7 - not a huge fan of reducing damage (especially since it affects Versatility), but it frees up a few points from crafting that I can put into Traps or Biology (plus, I like the Ferryman).

Crows

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Re: Spear/Versatility + Metathermics
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2022, 05:07:44 pm »
Second update:

The build hits another period of low efficacy immediately post-Depot A, roughly level 10-12. This is probably just due to Dominating being, you know, Dominating, but most human enemies you encounter immediately after Depot A are too sturdy to take down with just a few spear stabs, which becomes a serious problem when there are 3 or more people with guns. (For reference, I'm basing this assessment off of the bandits a few screens north of GMS (the ones that charge charons), and the gangsters guarding the Tunneler.) The addition of an Electroshock generator on a tungsten spear has helped a ton with damage when Impale is on cooldown, but my god it is incredibly hungry for batteries.

Part of the issue I seem to be running into is that spears' related feats are oriented towards defense, not offense. Without Impale, it's generally hard to do enough damage to finish one person a turn, and if you fail to finish the job they heal up, retreat, and fire at you from a distance. Chasing down the wounded is tough, partly because spears are a 20AP attack and partly because their friends are going to be firing on you while you do it. A lot of bandits also have high enough dodge that you need to use disables on your current target, not their out-of-range friends shooting at you. Again, the absence of Dirty Kick in this build is proving to be tough, and it's even more noticeable now that flaming barrels protect all those pipeworking bandits from being Cryostasis'ed. Unfortunately, spears are only a defensive weapon when you're up against melee attackers, and damage is high enough in Dominating that a PSI tacvest (18%DR/11DT) and efficient (670 health) med. shield don't cut it.

However: things have gone substantially smoother since hitting level 13/14 and shifting from tacvest to tungsten tin can. It was a bit time-consuming to track down quality metal plates since I haven't tackled Foundry's little animal control problem yet, but Core City merchants finally came through. Between Armor Sloping, Nimble, and some low-to-mid quality boot springs, I've got about 20MP on 67% armor penalty, with mechanical defense sitting at ~52%DR/28DT. I have also finally been able to invest 55 points into Temporal Manipulation for PTC, which not only improves mobility but increases damage output by 50% on turn 1 - it even lets me recharge the battery on turn 2.


Some other thoughts on this build:

I have basically never used the shotgun whatsoever. It seems interesting in practice, but it's the same AP cost as the spear and its effective range is much shorter than I remembered. This might just be dealing with a lower accuracy than I'm used to, so my assessment might very well change if/when I put a couple of spec points in Versatility and pick up Leading Shot. However, right now my default is to just walk the extra couple of tiles and poke my opponent with the spear. The high AP cost of both shotgun and spear also creates problems when trying to finish off a low health enemy (or, say, kill a Burrower spawn). I'll probably craft a low caliber assault rifle or SMG to bridge that gap; a knife or something might also be pretty useful.

I am intrigued by the Spear Throw feat, but the fact that precision scales off of throwing while damage scales off of melee is kind of troublesome. It may be workable to flashbang or Cryostasis an enemy prior to throwing, but that seems expensive and a little too conditional. On the other hand, Spear Throw might be really interesting on a Psychokinesis user - between TK Punch, Grounding, Electrokinesis, and Imprint, there are at least a few ways to reliably eliminate evasion at range.

In general, Psychokinesis seems like it might have been a better PSI path to combine with a spear. Both help trigger Opportunist damage, but there's a larger variety in PK. Cryokinesis is expensive in terms of AP, and it's not really feasible to attack all the targets that have been chilled by Cryo Orb. Force Field would be a huge help in corralling enemies so that I don't have to run after them. Combining Psychokinetic Chain and Sweep seems fairly conditional but also potentially very funny. On the other hand, trying to fit all of these different abilities in might feel very pinched with only 5 slots - some other part of the build would probably have to go.



I hope this kind of breakdown is useful for anyone trying to develop their own build!

Krigor

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Re: Spear/Versatility + Metathermics
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2022, 12:02:24 pm »
Are you using Spear, Metathermics or Shotguns as your main damage?
Overall your build seens very confusing and lacks focus.