Author Topic: Ultimate Cave Archmage - Tri-School Pure Psi (Max MT TM TC)  (Read 3699 times)

Elerai

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Ultimate Cave Archmage - Tri-School Pure Psi (Max MT TM TC)
« on: January 30, 2024, 08:37:34 am »
https://underrail.info/build/?HgMEBgMEEAoAAG0AAAAAeDdLAAA6UAYjQMKgAMKgwqAcAC05KD89KmQuwr0hVynCh8KGBXLCt8KKK8OZwp3CrsOH4qWyBeKmhgrfvA



So, this one I have a soft spot for, seeing this was my first build. I always like playing toolbox mages in games I am permitted to, this one was no different. Took like a week of restartitis to find something I was happy with... I share this so you don't have to. The main unique thing for Tranq Psi is Temporal Distortion. Anything else, even Cerebral Trauma, Psychosis Psi does better; mostly because Trance is a broken af drug.

First things: I think Psi is weak. At least, Tranquility Psi is. Most gun builds can splash 70 TM 140 MT to get the defining psi spells; so the main thing tranquility PSI has going for it is Locus of Control at 10 WIL; and the best silent assassination in game with Temporal Distortion + CC (Mental Breakdown/Cryostasis). Arena single fights are a joke for Tranquility Psi, but outside you'll be spending a lot of time to pull mobs into a single group with Noise/Traps to Thermo Destabilization + Grenade them; because those are your best AOEs, and their cooldowns are large; you don't really have DPS because Psi Points mechanic.

Stealth grenades are the cheat code for Psi, though. Tranq Psi needs almost no charons to do its thing; Psi Inhalants every 2-3 fights is still a lot cheaper than ammo, no repairs involved; and their crafting is pretty cheap. This gives Psi the deepest pockets to spend on consumables, like Stealth nades; the most OP thing for a class limited by Psi Points and Cooldowns.




Default Configuration    (Okay against most standard groups of enemies for the majority of the game)

Cryokinesis, Pyrokinesis, Pyrokinetic Stream, Temporal Distortion, Thermodynamic Destabilization, Mental Breakdown, Psycho-Temporal Contraction.

Extra Slot(s) go to Stasis, Neural Overload, Pseudo-Spatial Projection; as needed.
Early game, replace Breakdown with Cryostasis.
Late game, Neural Overload is very good against heavy armors, and you can Thermo Destabilize > Neural Overload and kill the target; then Premeditate + Locus + Breakdown the group and finish them off one by one. Can use a TC Muffled NO Filter Headband too.


Default Psi Headband:  Uni-Psi Muffled Extension

Can replace Psi-Circuit Extension with a Filter (Pyrokinetic Stream/Pyrokinesis typically).


Food:  Psi-Beetle Soup

+20% (3 School penalty) -15% (Food) -10% (Vest) -25% (160 Muffler) -10% (PN Flexibility) = -40%. Add Advanced Psi Empathy and use Single School Headband for truly insane reductions.


Enter fight stealthed, unstealth and sprint if needed, Flashbang or Locus Breakdown group; start stacking Temporal Distortions on the toughest guy in grenade radius of everybody. On the 2nd turn (when your Temporal Distortions are about to pop End of Turn), Thermo Destablize before or after finishing stacking Distortions. You want to ensure that guy doesn't die to Distortions, but instead comes as close to 1 HP as you can. Turn 3, main guy is destabilized and close to death, other guys woke up from CC (Flashbang lasts 2 turns); you Grenade/Pyrokinesis or Cryokinesis the Destabilized guy. If Cryokinesis kills him, Destabilization buff doesn't disappear and pops normally; dealing massive AOE damage. Mop up the rest with Cryokinesis/Pyrokinetic Stream as needed. PTC/Adrenaline + Booster/Muffler/Beetle Soup needed for big foes that need a lot of distortions.

So when does this fail?

(A) Other groups get aggroed when you CC the first. When this happens, you either need to pull them first with noise (TNT), bunch/stall with Bear Traps, or just CC them again (Flashbang first group, wait for second group, then Locus Breakdown them all). Or Locus Enrage instead of Breakdown and gamble. Enrage is honestly weaker than I thought; I ended up using it very rarely; since Tranq Psi is so dependant on enemies remaining bunched up for ~2 turns.

(B) All enemies are similar HP, so Thermo Destabilize doesn't kill. If this is because enemies are too weak; use normal AOEs like Pyrokinesis + Grenades; then Locus Breakdown/Flashbang. Then pick them off one by one with Cryokinesis/Pyrokinetic Stream. If they're too strong; you need stealth nades to pop on turn 3 of the combo (when the Distortions pop) to retreat. Consider re-innervating to include Cryokinetic Orb if needed; but remember Orb turns off Destabilization; even if it kills unlike Cryokinesis.

(C) Enemies have high Mech/Heat DR. This is the thing that completely counters your primary AOE source, Destabilization. Groups of robots do this; unfortunately, you don't really have a solution for this; and the main reason why I think Tranq Psi is weak. That doesn't mean you don't though. Continuum Ripple in the build is specifically for this scenario, as is Cerebral Trauma NO and Locus Enrage vs organics. If you have Plasma Beam; it can still be pretty strong in a Tranquility build with massive Psi cost reduction; so you can use it in this scenario. Investing in traps, as always, gives you the I-win button of trap spamming in those scenarios. Traps is also helpful to boost your low trap detection. You do have low carry capacity; keep that in mind. Can be worth taking Pack Rathound instead of Continuum Ripple if you do go for traps.

(D) CRAWLERS. While you can cast Pseudo-Spatial Projection if you have the time; unfortunately the F9 key is your most reliable option vs these. Another reason why I don't think this is a strong build, because crawlers single-handedly make this build Ironman unviable. Take Paranoia, use Detection Goggles, enter Crawler areas with Stealth Armor (not beetle vest) and Cloaking Device active; then Bear Trap yourself into a choke and make sound. Once the first crawler is detected, use flares liberally to reveal the rest. Killing them shouldn't be a problem afterwards. These fuckers are the main reason to go 4 PER instead of 3. Huge quality of life, trust me. Going for DEX 4 is to make it less point intensive to hit ~100 Throwing. You need that since you rely a lot on short range flashbangs.



So,  Psychokinesis? Honestly, you can do perfectly fine without it. While Imprint and Grounding sound nice, you don't have slots and usually have better options. The main reason for PK would be 100 for Implosion. With ~100 quality Beetle Vest and ~140 Uni-Psi Headband; you get 275 PK for 75% Max HP Implosion. Recur it with Entropic Recurrance, and everything will die. The problem is, even on Dominating 400% HP; Temporal Distortion is more than enough to oneshot.

Vs these bosses; crafting a Temporal Manipulation Muffled Temporal Distortion Filter headband will do good as well, you don't need Implosion. Tranquility never lacks single-target damage; what it lacks is AOE, and Electrokinesis is nowhere near enough to justify taking PK. Never really played around with Force Field; if it is good I can see PK being good; but even then, slots are an issue.



Take the bare minimum mechanics, biology and tailoring you need to craft the lowest quality beetle vest from the lowest quality carapace using the Underpie in the SGS kitchen as soon as you can. Increased costs is crippling for you, so use that vest to counteract the initial +10% from TM + MT innervation. The next +10% from adding Mental Breakdown comes quite late at ~Level 14 when you take Locus, you already took Psycho-Neural Flexibility at 12 to counteract this. Craft the best uni-psi muffled extension Headband by ~16, secondary module Energy Shields by ~18 (High/Medium or Medium/High is universal enough; keep a Low/Low for Burrowers). Skillpoints will be tight because Neurology needs 35 Bio; but getting your Neurology 25% Muffled Headband is a massive powerspike, as is that Power Management energy shield for explosions.

Join JKK and get the Jacket, and you can go to Expedition with your Persuasion very early; the 2nd raid gives you Spear-Staff, overall best weapon for you (sometimes the others are better). And Philosophy. Seriously, this is one build that wants that 80 Persuation ASAP for just that +15+10 Max Psi. JKK should give better headbands than even Oculus (164 vs 159), but very rarely I assume.

One optimization you can do lategame is Fight Response over Mantra. Adjust your HP with Sturdy Vests so that a Super Hypo heals you ~80% of max HP. Then lower HP to ~20-25% and enter a fight. You gain +10 AP from Fight Response (below 25% HP); then use Doctor's Belt + Hypo (2 AP) to heal to full and re-enable Tranquility. This nets you +8 AP first turn of the fight, but you can't use Hypos for that fight. Doctor feat helps here, letting you use even the highest quality Sturdy Vest with this tactic (as long as you're also equipped with Spear Staff). Whether this is worth it I don't know, I just went with Mantra since the game was almost over already.


Good luck, young padawan. May the force be with you!
« Last Edit: January 30, 2024, 09:32:32 am by Elerai »

Eidein

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Re: Ultimate Cave Archmage - Tri-School Pure Psi (Max MT TM TC)
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2024, 01:53:07 pm »
I honestly cant tell if you have 100 hours or this is a troll post.

Psi isn't weak

Extension band is bait

Don't join jkk, join core tech

Get minister Percival's robes

I used PSP and uncanny dodge in combination with stasis for crawlers and didn't f9 once on my DOM ironman

If you are using tm and mt then take flex not optimisation

4 perception does NOTHING absolutely nothing same with 4 dex it makes zero noticeable impact. Reduce int to 8 and dex and per to 3 and put your agi at 10 so you get blitz, if you struggle with detection wear detection goggles and swap them out.

« Last Edit: January 30, 2024, 02:12:25 pm by PoopiemcButtface »

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Elerai

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Re: Ultimate Cave Archmage - Tri-School Pure Psi (Max MT TM TC)
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2024, 05:14:49 pm »
Wow, two replies! That's a new record for me.

Anyways, a little context. This was my first build, so its not completely optimized. I considered the 10 AGI version; but I liked the extra slot from 10 INT. Maybe more experienced players with meta-knowledge will be fine with 8 INT; but for a first playthrough, the extra slot is helpful. Same reason why I went for circuit extension; though of course, from an optimization viewpoint, that is a trap. If you're optimizing, go for 10 AGI and 8 INT, it'll make a relevant difference lategame. The MP is not particularly relevant, if you're using a stealth nade, 6 AGI + Sprint is fine; if you're not, you're out of Psi points and you probably don't have enough space to run away until your CDs come back, at least not until Stasis; but if you want Stasis, that extra slot is pretty helpful too.

Three schools and not two because (a) Destabilization, and (b) Early game is a lot better with metathermics. Of course, you can stop once your effective MT is around 140; so you won't have Pyrokinesis/Pyro Stream with Pyromaniac/Thermodynamics, but it'll open up slots. Its a different playstyle than me, so I can't give advice there. Maybe you would need to abuse noise/traps more, be more stealthy etc.

As for the guide, I have read it; but Psi, at least for newer players playing on Dominating, isn't just about the build. Its also about the combos. Maybe include a couple of sample fights from each stage? (early game, midgame, lategame etc). Explain the decision making? It is pretty important part of a psi guide; unless I missed a youtube video somewhere in the guide.

Uncanny Dodge for crawlers is honestly very innovative, I didn't think of that. Probably won't help too much early game; since build is a bit feat strapped early; but yeah, I can see it solving all Crawler problems later on.

Is that +1 WIL from Minister Percieval's Robe that good? I liked my -10% Psi cost too. Also, first playthrough; didn't want to murderhobo when I was not playing a murderhobo.

Why Coretech though? High quality cores? I wanted JKK so that I get two merchants per refresh to check for high quality headbands. Plus wanting to start Expedition earlier but not waste too much skillpoints on persuasion.


One thing I'll say though, this build's power curve is extremely smooth. Aside from my trouble with crawlers and some fights vs groups of heavy armor guys (one of those was trying to fight the group of 3 Strongmen in the room before Phil's Arm at level ~16-17; I skipped it with stealth and some save-scumming), this build had little difficulty throughout the game even on first playthrough. I just felt I needed to prep way more for fights; with traps, making noise etc. A lot of my F9 presses were by being lazy and not preparing. I recently started playing an Energy Pistol Ambush build, and it feels superior to Psi; not needing nearly as much prep, so that is why I felt like Psi is weaker. Traps are OP as hell though, so even dominating difficulty is not particularly difficult as long as your build is functional.

Eidein

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Re: Ultimate Cave Archmage - Tri-School Pure Psi (Max MT TM TC)
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2024, 01:24:06 pm »
When it comes to agi I follow 2 schools of thought, if I'm playing a tranquillity build i go for 10 agi and take blitz and uncanny dodge two very powerful feats. If im playing psychosis I take 10 con and get Last stand and just skip agility, TM will carry my movement.

On TC builds the robes are good, if you aren't primarily using TC then just use beetle tacvest.

You're right metathermics is king early on, on any psi build im levelling it to 35 for cryostasis and to stomp the early game with cryokinesis its just an insane early spell.

The only crawler you encounter before you might grab it is the one in junkyard. Just save your crawler exploration until you have PSP or uncanny.

Coretech is a very decent electronics merchant, you usually don't want to be getting your psiband components from any merchant other than Constantine in the mid-late game. Since having even 8 INT allows you to craft a 160 psiband at lv16.


Quote
Maybe include a couple of sample fights from each stage? (early game, midgame, lategame etc). Explain the decision making? It is pretty important part of a psi guide; unless I missed a youtube video somewhere in the guide.

Whilst I have alot of psi fights already uploaded to youtube its true they arent referenced, its a good idea thanks.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2024, 01:25:57 pm by PoopiemcButtface »